Gas engine class(es)

[Gator 340]

Nope I didnt figure any finger pointing, the question has to be asked.... I would personally like to be able to use it, but what does everyone else think.
Bill

I'd have to say no just for the simple fact that it is not allowed in the other gas classes. Not to mention, as you said it gives a noticable performance increase which would put newbies to the class at a disadvantage assuming that you run pump gas in a gas engine.

~Mitch

I agree with JR lets keep it fair for every body. If we start alowing this and alowing that than we will might as well call it open gas tunnel any thing goes next thing you know some guy will show up at the pond with a chain saw motor strapped to the back of a boat.

 

[Gator 340]

Nope I didnt figure any finger pointing, the question has to be asked.... I would personally like to be able to use it, but what does everyone else think.
Bill

I'd have to say no just for the simple fact that it is not allowed in the other gas classes. Not to mention, as you said it gives a noticable performance increase which would put newbies to the class at a disadvantage assuming that you run pump gas in a gas engine.

~Mitch

I agree with JR lets keep it fair for every body. If we start alowing this and alowing that than we will might as well call it open gas tunnel any thing goes next thing you know some guy will show up at the pond with a chain saw motor strapped to the back of a boat.

 

[Don Ferrette]

Every things looks ok to me so far. BUT i was talking with my Scale buddy Randy and I think that Don will agree if we use the word SCALE than all boats must be to scale with a picture of ther real boat it was scaled after. So like Gabe stated earlier in the post we have to go with the word SPORT that way we can go both direction scale and fictional scale.

It's fine like it is as the key phrasing is "scale appearance" and not built to scale. The wording of scale appearance means the idea is to make them look real.

 

[Gator 340]

Every things looks ok to me so far. BUT i was talking with my Scale buddy Randy and I think that Don will agree if we use the word SCALE than all boats must be to scale with a picture of ther real boat it was scaled after. So like Gabe stated earlier in the post we have to go with the word SPORT that way we can go both direction scale and fictional scale.

It's fine like it is as the key phrasing is "scale appearance" and not built to scale. The wording of scale appearance means the idea is to make them look real.

Hey if it works for the masses than it works for me.

 

[waltr]

Scale appearance works for me too.

I really don't want to re-paint my woodstuff.

Like it the way it is but the sponsons can get logos.

https://www.intlwaters.com/gallery/displayimage...m=816&pos=7

And the fuel thing,I'll go with the masses on that one.My boats ride in a trailer and I can sympathize with anyone that has to smell gasoline for a long journey. Hey,it might just be better than Nicotene while driving too

There's a big plus for NITRO.

 

[Eddy de Vries]

Have been offline for a while due to a computer crash.

It looks like there is no XLS27 class any more and I better cancel my order for the QD 25 ?

 

[waltr]

Have been offline for a while due to a computer crash.It looks like there is no XLS27 class any more and I better cancel my order for the QD 25 ?

Eddy,

Don't panic yet.

I really don't think that we intended to rule out Quickdraws and or J&Gs did we?

I just finished a Zenoah with a J&G jug kit.I was intending to run it on the big tunnel.Legal or not at this point?

XLS is a bit more open than the LS.I'd rather see the XLS rules,but I will welcome the new class either way.

 

[rcpilotbill]

Since I am not knowlegeable in regards to some of the mods that you guys are talking about, I have to ask... what kind of money are we talking about for what kind of performance gains?

I hope that we are not looking to put a deepest wallet wins class together... With the QD25's pulling over 8HP at a cost of $1500, it would not exactly be a fair situation for those running even a mod zenoah that you can get 6+HP out of for an additional $350 over the cost of the stock engine. At this point as has been stated already, almost no one is running a stock motor, but do the guys with mod engines want to put them aside and spend on QD's to keep up? It seems to me that the people with the boats currently are all (I think) running Zenoahs or Sikk, and we would want to create guidelines based around that group, yet allow room for others as we have with the any lower unit rule.

I don't want to jump off the deep end with a comment, but as the comments have started from the other side of things (i.e. I guess I should cancel, etc..... meaning if we dont allow it there will be one boat not built.) If this does indeed turn in to a deepest pocket wins class, my boat will be for sale. I am not interested in dropping another $1500 on to my already expensive boat just to try to keep up with deeper pockets.

I do find it strange that we want to keep it fair for everyone by not allowing $5 gallon white gas, but nitro mixed gas (that nobody can test for) and $1500 engines and unlimited $$$ modifications are hopefully fine?

i am not trying to upset or put anyone off, these are simply a few of my concerns regarding the last few posts....

Bill

 

[Eddy de Vries]

Why not leave both LS27 and XLS27 options open ?

 

[AFIRacing]

Thanks for stepping up and Drafting this out , This is how it gets started, and we must scour every section for loopholes, I thinkl we are well on are way. Again Good Job .

Tony , hows mom and sis, for sure not coming this weekend?

Steve Hearl

 

[waltr]

Why not leave both LS27 and XLS27 options open ?

Eddy,

At this point,there just aren't enough boats.We need to keep the few that we have on the same page.

And I think the way our LS is structured,it's really a combo of both with the allowance of Zenoah mod motors.

Bill,

I don't think anyone's upset,we're just trying to sort out what is allowed and what's not.I think Eddy wasen't speaking of canceling his plans to race Gas ob,just to cancel the Quickdraw for a different option (I hope).I went back to check Mike Byers gas boat sale,and he's not selling it with the Quickdraw either, just a Zenoah.I won't spent $1500 on a Quickdraw either.So at this point,no one is running a Quickdraw and it's good timing for the new rules.

But I am curious if my Zenoah with the J&G jug would be legal.It has a Zenoah block,crank,piston etc.I don't believe it makes any more hp than a mod Zenoah,just better reliability.

On the boat now is a pure stock out of the box Sikk,but since almost all motors seem to be moded,it's the old keep up with the Jones' thing I guess.

With never running gas stuff before, I'm just trying to figure where the line is I guess.

Like I've said before,what it is,it is and am really looking forward to running these big tunnels, whatever the rules may be.

 

[rcpilotbill]

The way that I read the latest package we would have to remove line #7

7. The engine external parts shall remain as originally manufactured within series except as shown in Part 3. Clarification: No water-cooled engine parts shall be used with air-cooled engine parts. Common engine parts that are used on both engines models may be interchanged. Slide valve exhaust adapters may not be used with carburetor equipped engines.

• Adjustable mixture controls will be allowed, however the original needle valve must remain in its original position.

If we add line 3 from the XLS 27 rules

3. Any and all modifications may be made to the engine. The cylinder and head may be a

multi-piece assembly and head buttons are allowed.

That simply makes the it the XLS rule as I read it.... the QD is a commercially available engine and the only other line that makes the two rule packages different is line 3. How would we tell the QD owners they can't run if we add line 3.

The LS27 package reads:

3. Internal and external modifications may be made to the engine’s major and or minor parts. However,

the cylinder and head assembly must be a single unit. No removable heads and/or head buttons

are allowed.

and I believe and let me know if I am wrong, that it is this line the actually defines the QD's (and other engines I am sure) out of the LS27 class.

If simply removing line 7 makes the J&G jug kit legal, then that is an option that everyone here needs to chime in about. As should they regarding this topic as well.

Eddy,

I sure hope that if the QD's are not legal, that it will not stop you from building a boat anyhow..... We would sure love to have another boat running in the class

Bill

 

[rcpilotbill]

After posting, I realize that #7 would not have to be removed, but Line 3 would need to be altered and read

3. Internal and external modifications may be made to the engine’s major and or minor parts. However,

the cylinder and head assembly must be a single unit. No removable heads and/or head buttons

are allowed. After market cylinder and Jug kits allowed.

This would allow the kits, but they too would have to be a single unit head assembly.....

Bill

 

[waltr]

After posting, I realize that #7 would not have to be removed, but Line 3 would need to be altered and read

3. Internal and external modifications may be made to the engine’s major and or minor parts. However,

the cylinder and head assembly must be a single unit. No removable heads and/or head buttons

are allowed. After market cylinder and Jug kits allowed.

This would allow the kits, but they too would have to be a single unit head assembly.....

Bill

Thanks Bill.

I did order the motor the same time that I ordered the Woodstuff but haven't run it yet.

Just trying to get used to the boat 1st.

If I can't run it,no sweat,I'll order another. But we want your opinions out there please.

Do we have any other issues out there?

And everyone please speak up.We really want and need your feedback to make this work for everyone.Here's your chance to make a difference.

 

[jaxracer]

I do find it strange that we want to keep it fair for everyone by not allowing $5 gallon white gas, but nitro mixed gas (that nobody can test for) and $1500 engines and unlimited $$$ modifications are hopefully fine?
i am not trying to upset or put anyone off, these are simply a few of my concerns regarding the last few posts....

Bill

I believe that the majority decision was to run the white gas per the information given by Don. It's really not that big of a deal, I was just speaking on the basis of conforming with the other gas classes, but if you want to run it, run it.

As far as allowing/ not allowing Quikdraws, seeing as most of us here are gas newbies, what is the real difference between a Zenoah and a Quikdraw that makes the Quikdraws so much more powerfull? I think a Quickdraw uses a sleeve like the nitro motors. Is there anything else? Also which rule specificly negates the use of a Quikdraw in the LS27 rules?

~Mitch

 

[Gator 340]

I am for what ever works for the Majority I think we all know we can not please ever one no mater how hard we try or what we do. And I say that in a friendly tone with no disrespect to any one. The funny thing about this is I purchased my boat with the intent to run it down at my lake house on Lake Lochlussa and possibly at the tunnel champs. But back to the subject at hand the majority of us have basicly the same motors with what ever mods we have had done so we need to stick with what we have so far and get it sent in and aproved.

 

[AFIRacing]

AMEN

 

[rcpilotbill]

Thats the way that I feel as well....

How does everyone feel about the current setup? Do we wish to make the changes to line 3 in the LS27 to allow aftermarket jugs and cylinders (after market jugs are good right :lol: )

Bill

 

[AFIRacing]

HAMMER DOOOOOWN!!!!!!

 

[waltr]

Hey Guys,

After thinking about it,request retracted.

Lets just leave the rules as is.I'll find a use for the J&G kit and build another motor.

If this rule gets changed,which one next.So,lets go with the rules as written.

I'll go with the hammer down than too.

Even though after market jugs are great,I prefer all natural anyway. :lol: :lol: :lol: