Miller American re-build

[misshydro]

here is some pics of my boat for inspiration for you . its full glass hull .

cheers wayne B)

thats what joe is pickingup.. fiberglass aeromarine hull.

 

[wayne middlemiss]

here is some pics of my boat for inspiration for you . its full glass hull .

cheers wayne B)

thats what joe is pickingup.. fiberglass aeromarine hull.

my boat is not an aeromarine hull , but its from my own mold.

 

[mark couty]

Hi Kevin if you would be interested in buying another hull I have a Miller American and an Atlas Van lines I would like to sell. I could e mail you pics if you like. Mark.

 

[Kevin Knapp]

Hi Kevin if you would be interested in buying another hull I have a Miller American and an Atlas Van lines I would like to sell. I could e mail you pics if you like. Mark.

I would love to but $ is tight. Send some pics and prices to [email protected] and i will kick it around...

 

[Kevin Knapp]

So I pulled the deck. It came off a lot easier than I thought. Here is what I have to work with.

If the deck all came up all in one piece would it be ok to clean it up and reuse or should I cut fresh ones?

 

[Hydro Junkie]

I can see were there was water in the back two compartments due to staining but I can't tell if there was any real damage. If the bottom seems solid, I would cut new decks using the originals as patterns. You COULD move the fuel tanks to under the deck along side the engine and the radio to under the cockpit if you wish to eliminate some of the prop weight. If you like the look of the boat with tails, you can buy/make a set of tails and mount them so that they don't penetrate the deck. I know hgatjens has a thread in the forum somewhere explaining how to do so.

Ted, your description of how to remove the deck was easy to understand and was the same process I would have said. That being the case, I couldn't see the point in trying to add anything.

 

[Kevin Knapp]

Im going to look into mounting the tank inside the hull and relocate the radio box. What type of epoxy do you guys use? I have some loctite two part 5 minute epoxy. Is that ok or should I use something else?

 

[Tall Fella]

Hello everybody .

Kevin K . , to me it looks like there is very little timber that has been sealed by a West Systems or similar epoxy product . Your idea about the 5 minute epoxy is only good enough for tacking parts in place . West Systems has more than 1 reducer that makes easier to work with according to low and high temperatures , not sure of the numbers though . I have seen boats over here in Australia built completely out of timber that were not always 1 sheet thickness , meaning that to have a piece 1/4 " thick - they laminated 4 thin sheets of 1/16 with West Systems to give it shape and strength and later on was involved in a racing incident that needed repairing . The hardest part we heard later on was getting through the epoxy . So this hull looks like it needs a lot of sanding on the inside before some West Systems or similar product is applied . Another good move before a replacement deck is applied would be some flotation placed in the compartments , but not the two part / pressure pack version - it has a tendency to grow and has the ability to swell so much that the deck will seperate from the bottom of your boat .

Regards

Ian Baas

Tall Fella Racing

Australia

 

[Kevin Knapp]

so you're saying I should use something stronger like West System to apply the deck and to seal the inside?

Would the hull need flotation being that its a wood hull?

If I mount the fuel tank in the hull, which side should it go on?

 

[Kevin Knapp]

So I was looking at the West system and that stuff isn't cheap. What is a similar product that is less costly and more readily available?

 

[Tall Fella]

Hello everybody .

Kevin K. , yes - that is correct about using West Systems or something similar to seal the timber and rejoin a new deck to the bottom of the boat . Even though the boat should be completely airtight after the deck is replaced , it's a good move to install a few drain holes in the boat and use a rubber bung while the boat is running . Put 1 at the rear of each sponson and another near the transom so that the boat can air out and drain any water that manages to find it's way inside the hull as already been found after you removed the deck . Do put some block foam / polystyrene in the cavities between the framework . With regard to the fuel tanks , I recommend a 3 tank system - 1 each side of the motor and a small ( donkey / hopper tank - 2 oz. max ) just in front of the motor . Also go to your local Supermarket and buy 3 - 5KG Kitchen Scales which you put under the rear edge of each sponson and the strut . This enables you see where the weight of the boat pushes down on the hull , most boats have the CG just near the rear edge of the sponsons . The framework can possibly lightened up . Hopefully a member over there can find you a copy of the article about the Star Wars boat from the ealy 1990's in the now defunct Radio Control Boat Modeller and pass it on to you . Hopefully this helps with your enquiries .

Regards

Ian Baas

Tall Fella Racing

Australia

 

[Larry K]

Hey Kevin - Ian is right about 5 min epoxy. You don't have any working time. It's only good for tacking & spot repairs. What's even more important is 5 min is not waterproof! You usually see something like "resists water" on the label. I don't know if any epoxy is truly waterPROOF if exposed directly for long periods but slower setting epoxies are definitely more resistant. Your cheapest option would be to go to a hobby shop or hardware store & pick up some slow-set epoxy (30 min or more). It comes in separate bottles (usually 8oz pack or more) instead of the handy-dandy syringe dispenser like your 5 min so pick up some small plastic cups & popsicle sticks for mixing & some acid brushes for applying. A little heat from a hair dryer will allow you to brush a nice even coat!

 

[Dasboatman]

Kevin,

Here is a pic of the internals of a Dumas Miller I helped a Friend with in 1990 or so. Martin framed the hull and I made some significant changes to the sponsons, and to the inside of the hull to make it stronger,added some foam for additional strength, and flotation.This hull has the fuel tank forward of the engine, and the radio box aft. The servos were accessable through a taped on hatch in the center section, the receiver and battery were tucked in to the section to port of the main radio box. I built new uprights and horizontal wing foam cored, covered with 1/64 ply as I recall. I think I used the 'TIMBER' that came in the Dumas kit for tail feather construction - for repairs to my house. The boat was finished with K&B Superpoxy - no longer available.

I prefer to build with 30 minute Slow-cure Epoxy. I like Bob Smith Industries - it comes in two 9 ounce tubes, the resin with a black lable the hardener with a yellow lable. Most LHS put their own lable on the tubes, but if you look on the back at the bottom you'll see Bob Smith Industries.I have never liked any 5 minute epoxy product. They often cure rubbery, and some are water soluable it seems. I do use West Systems Epoxy for coating and for putting fiberglass cloth on wood hulls. Good luck with your project. CHEERS !!! Bob

 

[Kevin Knapp]

Thats a good looking boat!!

All these ideas and tips, you guys have my mind going 100mph. I'm not going to go the authentic paint path but I do like the 2 or three tank idea. I'm still brainstorming the radio box in the nose and how that's going to work. Another question is the drive shaft. Should I leave it fixed or go with the adjustable flex shaft?

Again, thanks for all the input guys/gals. I need to come up with a solid game plane before I start cutting and gluing. This thing is going to take me months to finish....

 

[Dasboatman]

"..... In the past , Steve has been registered on International Waters - just not sure what his member name is......"

Hey Ian,

No problem Mate - - I'll give you an assist. Steve Gualtieri's site is: www.rcboatcompany.com

Kevin,

Have a look at Steve's site when you get a chance. He has some videos there that will answer some questions for you, and show you what Steve has available - all his stuff is epoxy glass - very well done. CHEERS !!! Bob

 

[Larry K]

Thats a good looking boat!!

All these ideas and tips, you guys have my mind going 100mph. I'm not going to go the authentic paint path but I do like the 2 or three tank idea. I'm still brainstorming the radio box in the nose and how that's going to work. Another question is the drive shaft. Should I leave it fixed or go with the adjustable flex shaft?

Again, thanks for all the input guys/gals. I need to come up with a solid game plane before I start cutting and gluing. This thing is going to take me months to finish....

Hey Kevin - You might want to back-up a little. If this is your first boat and/or you're not racing it, you may want to simplify the process. A lot of what has been suggested is aimed at making your hull more competitive. Nothing wrong with that but if you're just learning, you might want to just clean it up, re-deck it, leave the shaft, etc & go run it. Even veterans sometimes have problems with multiple tank set-ups. You will learn a lot & will probably be ready to move up from there.

Larry K

 

[Kevin Knapp]

I do race in a club up here in WA. Our 60 class is like the bastard child of the club. So yes it will be raced but im not necessarily going for district points. None the less I would like a good running boat that is pretty well set up....if that makes sence?

This isnt my 1st boat but this is the first one that Im reworking. I have a MV duece, hot shot 3.5, atlas van lines 40, and a miss circus circus 60(thats totally shot). But to be honest this is the 1st one that is getting a full thought process work over.

 

[misshydro]

Kevin,

Here is a pic of the internals of a Dumas Miller I helped a Friend with in 1990 or so. Martin framed the hull and I made some significant changes to the sponsons, and to the inside of the hull to make it stronger,added some foam for additional strength, and flotation.This hull has the fuel tank forward of the engine, and the radio box aft. The servos were accessable through a taped on hatch in the center section, the receiver and battery were tucked in to the section to port of the main radio box. I built new uprights and horizontal wing foam cored, covered with 1/64 ply as I recall. I think I used the 'TIMBER' that came in the Dumas kit for tail feather construction - for repairs to my house. The boat was finished with K&B Superpoxy - no longer available.

I prefer to build with 30 minute Slow-cure Epoxy. I like Bob Smith Industries - it comes in two 9 ounce tubes, the resin with a black lable the hardener with a yellow lable. Most LHS put their own lable on the tubes, but if you look on the back at the bottom you'll see Bob Smith Industries.I have never liked any 5 minute epoxy product. They often cure rubbery, and some are water soluable it seems. I do use West Systems Epoxy for coating and for putting fiberglass cloth on wood hulls. Good luck with your project. CHEERS !!! Bob

I would go what dasha said,plus use 1/32 ply on the top skins and use 1/16 for the bottom running surfaces....and as from what I see we're not the only ones that uses Bob smith industries 30 slow cure epoxy to use to glue our wood with. With Dumas kit all the mohogany is junk,to frail..If I have to ever do another dumas kit? I would be replacing the mohogany with ply.

 

[Dasboatman]

Hey Kevin,

Since we're Brainstorming, here are a couple other ideas.

First pic is my Oberto when new in 2000. Single tank forward of engine, radio box behind wngine and pipe stinger stuck out the cowl.

When Florida went from IMPBA to NAMBA - the unmuffled pipe wasn't going to work, and I didn't like the idea of a tip muffler sticking out of the cowl.

I moved the radio box to the starboard side of engine, used a GOLD-N-ROD control; rod set #517, using an easy "S" bend to connect rudder servo to rudder. Nice thing about this - - it leaves the entire tub area open to play with different pipes, tip mufflers, etc. Another benefit was that I was able to remove one pound of lead out of the forward sponsons to balance the hull to CG, so now the boat is a pound lighter than when it was new.

Just something to think about since the deck is off. CHEERS !!! Bob

 

[BobGutsell]

I would go what dasha said,plus use 1/32 ply on the top skins and use 1/16 for the bottom running surfaces....and as from what I see we're not the only ones that uses Bob smith industries 30 slow cure epoxy to use to glue our wood with. With Dumas kit all the mohogany is junk,to frail..If I have to ever do another dumas kit? I would be replacing the mohogany with ply.

Doesn't 1/32 warp and go ripply?