IMPBA Internats

[bzubee]

It has for the most part always been left up to the host club to choose what format they wish to use when they submit their bid for the IMPBA Iternational Regatta they have 2 official choices the traditional version and the newer version. Now with Don's proposed version which he had worked on and submitted according to the rulebook there is a 3rd version very similar to what Brian was suggesting the big difference the winners would not be US-1 Winners they would be National Champions. The ultimate decision is left to the board to decide wether a club gets to host the IMPBA Iternational Regatta. As Tony stated if there is no other clubs wishing to host the event then it is a very easy choice allow it with the format the host club wants to use or do not have the event. This choice was made a few times in the past history of the IMPBA.

Right now no club has submitted a bid or even inquired about submitting a bid under any type of format so it is looking like there will be no IMPBA Iternational Regatta for 2007 unless a club steps up to do a lot of work in a short time. Hosting any kind of week long event is a lot of major work just ask any CD or club that has done it one time. Even Jerry Crowther could not get over how much work there was at the 2006 NAMBA Nationals he CD.

Everything changes and model boating has also changed over the years remember boaters used to start engines using a leather string. Timed events used to be done with bomb sights. This additional format will just be another choice to entice a club to step up and submit a bid to host the IMPBA Iternational Regatta. If clubs and modle boaters like the format it may end up being the primary format club choose to use. THe traditional version is still available but none of the oldtimers care to submit bids to use it since they do not want to do all of the work to host the event. That may be the way the newer version goes also if this latest version takes off and the boaters like racing under this format.

Bottom line is if you really like a certain format STEP UP AND SUBMIT A BID with the format you want to use.

Bill Zuber

IMPBA President

 

[Lamar_Huff]

JOE W SAID: Come on Don You spent 4 days in Atlanta Spring 2006 Racing. Just for a 2 day event... Hell you got there before Ralph & I did...... WE pulled out of Tennesee mid day Wednesday. You were there when I got there... 2007 I`ll be there for 4 days again... You think Wendy will accept our entries Now?????

I think Wendy would have a few choice words for anyone trying to enter this early!!!

Lamar

 

[Joe Warren]

Come on Don You spent 4 days in Atlanta Spring 2006 Racing. Just for a 2 day event... Hell you got there before Ralph & I did...... WE pulled out of Tennesee mid day Wednesday. You were there when I got there... 2007 I`ll be there for 4 days again... You think Wendy will accept our entries Now????? :lol: :lol:

Joe you're asolutely right & I'll do it again on '07. Four days with as much intensity or hype as one could stand!! Hell yeah I'll burn 4 instead of 12-14 vacation days for that feeling any day. B)

BTW- didn't it take almost THREE DAYS to complete the Internats timed events the last time it was done where everyone ran for a time? I also recall there used to be a per racer boat limit as well.....

I attended a nats in southern FL 2001 or 02 that timed all boats that WANTED TO ENTER US-1. It was 200 plus boats plus the first 3 1/2 days of TT & Saw. That club collected over $2000 just for the timed event..... Now this did pay for the Nice awards @ the end of the week. Normally a club will set down & determine the format that allows for the Max Profit because that Just what your left with after the nats. Some clubs have benifited 10G`s or more with the Current Format. Bill mentioned Long Hrs & Effort. But the host club stands to benifit a lot also...... I enjoy the Local (atlanta) National Races & Only a few locations grandfathered in on this. But I personally would not waste a 7-9 day vacation plus travel & expense to Only heat race & heat race Somemore @ the nats. The integrity of the US-1 Must be Maintained if the Format is Changed to Heat Racing format Only..... I DO NOT see were we are going to SAVE TIME IF after 4 days of Heat Racing. We began to Heat Race Again the Top 6 of all classes on Thursday Morning....... True this changes the Format........ But time saved ........ ??????

 

[Don Ferrette]

Well at this rate all it looks like you're gonna have for an '07 Internats to talk about is "integrity". Gee that sounds like fun ..... h34r:

A very well respected, long time prominent boater & previous multiple US-1 winner said to me not too long ago that the title of US-1 does represent a great accomplishment, but outside the IMPBA almost nobody has a clue what that title of US-1 even means. He went on to say that every time he has someone over who's not an IMPBA boater he winds up explaining US-1 when they see his plaques on the wall, but how everyone, even the mailman would know what a National Champion means. An interesting way to look at things ..... :blink:

You guys just keep on beating up on the idea of a club considering hosting under a different format & see what it gets you, I'm done with this BS........ <_<

 

[piper_chuck]

As I'm reading through this thread I keep wondering why the International Model Power Boat association even uses US to name their champions. Have we forgotten our Northern members?

 

[Marty Davis]

One thing that people are forgetting. One person touched on it a little.

If a person wants to race 5 heats only and not have to mess with the timed events, He/She can attend only those days where heat racing are happening. They could then attend only about 4 days of Internats. They can also decide whether to attend the Banquet at the end of the week also. There is a lot of choices for the competitor and I have seen people attend individual events over the years. I have seen people ONLY attend the SAW event. I have seen people attend both timed events. I have seen people attend only the specialty events. I have seen people attend only the banquet, and I have seen people attend just the heat racing.

By the way, the amount of $$$ is considerable to the host club for the timed events. Especially if everyone is allowed to run them.

Not sure why people are getting mad about a discussion, some very creative things are born out of this type discussion. Everyone has an opinion. The providing of information many times adds to their knowlege base and even changes ones mind.

I wrote a direct message to Bill Zuber indicating that if IMPBA were to look at the most successful part of the RC Hobby, we would adopt the system used by the RC Car Racers. They have a set of preliminary heats with random draw which places people in various Mains based on their performance. These preliminary heats are fun for everyone and get the racer more racing. Then they go into a Main which is based on their performance: A, B, C, D, E etc. The people who go into the C main for example race people who are of similar skill level. Those people in the A Main were the ones contesting for the World Championship (it was the Indy World Championships that I had experience with). It is a great system and one in which everyone gets challenged.

I believe that the current system used in IMPBA accomplishes the same thing, but this is a possible alternative.

Several people have indicated that the elimination of the timed events would make it just another heat race. It probably would have that effect over a gradual period of time. There is no reason for IMPBA not to try other formats, but it should be done carefully so as not to dilute the importance of the US#1 award.

Would you look at someone who won US#1 without the timed events in the same way that you look at someone who has accomplished it having to compete in the timed events. Gary Turner has a lot of important information in his reply and people should re-read it. There have been several people who have won a US#1 after many years of trying and the award really means something to them. Our hobby is so small that you will always have to explain what the placque on the wall means. It is a placque that means something to the person winning it - who cares about the mailman? :lol:

Maybe people can keep discussing this and there will some breakthrough - without getting mad if people do not accept your opinion as the only way. I can do that...... But I would like to provide an opinion based on attending MANY MANY Internats and having won some awards.

Marty Davis

 

[Don Ferrette]

I for one am not mad, just tired of the same people who flat out refuse to consider other possibilities or options. <_<

 

[bzubee]

Here is some facts pulled form the history of IMPBA on hosts of the Internats.

Distirct Five has hosted the INTERNATS 12 times since 1957

District Four has hosted the INTERNATS 9 times since 1957

Distirct Fourteen has hosted the INTERNATS 7 times since 1957

Distirct Three has hosted the INTERNATS 6 times since 1957

Distirct Two has hosted the INTERNATS 6 times since 1957

They were also held in California 2 times and the state of Washington once

Other hosts were (2)NY, (1)GA, (1)NJ, and (1)VA

It's time for some other areas to step up to the plate and host the Internats in one of the formats mentioned.

With these numbers I guess you can see why District Five is so passionate about the Internats and Model boat racing. Any District willing to sacrfice that much work and time off from their families is very dedicated to the sport.

Bill Zuber

 

[Marty Davis]

Here is some facts pulled form the history of IMPBA on hosts of the Internats.

Distirct Five has hosted the INTERNATS 12 times since 1957

District Four has hosted the INTERNATS 9 times since 1957

Distirct Fourteen has hosted the INTERNATS 7 times since 1957

Distirct Three has hosted the INTERNATS 6 times since 1957

Distirct Two has hosted the INTERNATS 6 times since 1957

They were also held in California 2 times and the state of Washington once

Other hosts were (2)NY, (1)GA, (1)NJ, and (1)VA

It's time for some other areas to step up to the plate and host the Internats in one of the formats mentioned.

With these numbers I guess you can see why District Five is so passionate about the Internats and Model boat racing. Any District willing to sacrfice that much work and time off from their families is very dedicated to the sport.

Bill Zuber

Count Districts 14 & 4 together as they were most of the years, and they are far and away the leader in number of times the Internats were hosted.

Marty Davis

 

[Wesleys Custom Graphics]

I kinda like the idea of a b and c main. We've done this with sprint cars and for the guy who knows he won't win "US1" still can get some great racing in. After all , he spent the same money on entry and hotel .For the guy having a bad day, he still has 1 chance to get back into the b main or a main and win US1.

just a thought

 

[Mark Bullard]

There are other ways to do this without changing the format. I had said this in 1988 when Art McMeans was setting this up for the Internats in Slidell. You say that you have a small lake. Jackson TN's lake is not that big and I could not see running a Internats on a lake much smaller. Oval Trophy Trials are not a problem. Straight Away are. How to fix that problem is to place 100' markers in the middle of the straight away. So the markers will be 50' from the center of the course each way. The timing equipment will be placed there. Of course there can be no records for the Straight Away but the Oval can still be able to have records.

Someone says that there are no records set at a Internat. Wrong there have been many records set at a Internats. We had two set this year, but the host club did not have their course set right. So the records did not stand.

This is the premier event of the year. So it should be run with the I's dotted and the T's crossed. Anything less is nothing.

Mark

 

[AWaddle322]

Marty,

In the last 8 years 4 Internats have been held in district 5. Thats 50 percent of the time in recent history.

Don,

If your so pasonite about this, why dont you and your club step up to the plate and host the 2007 internats under your guidelines. Those of that race the internats are open minded enough to give your system a try if you are willing to put your money were your mouth is.

Sincerely,

Allen Waddle

 

[Marty Davis]

Marty,

In the last 8 years 4 Internats have been held in district 5. Thats 50 percent of the time in recent history.

Don,

If your so pasonite about this, why dont you and your club step up to the plate and host the 2007 internats under your guidelines. Those of that race the internats are open minded enough to give your system a try if you are willing to put your money were your mouth is.

Sincerely,

Allen Waddle

Allen:

District 4 (the old one with both D4 & D14) have held 16 Internats. What's your point. Is the fact that the most recent ones have been in D-5 more relevant. I appreciate that you guys have steped up recently, but of the 16 Internats, at least 2 were also the World Championships held as part of the Nats. There were several where major events were paid by sponsors spending thousands of dollars. There have been sacrifices by everyone who puts on one, but I don't see any reason to look past the other people who have put on much larger Internats than have been held in the past 15 years or so. I know that you were not boating during the older Internats, but I can assure you that the task was no easier then than now. Point is, hosting the Internats is a huge responsibility and a huge chore and anyone who does it has steped forward.

Marty Davis

 

[Mark Bullard]

One thing that people are forgetting. One person touched on it a little.

If a person wants to race 5 heats only and not have to mess with the timed events, He/She can attend only those days where heat racing are happening. They could then attend only about 4 days of Internats. They can also decide whether to attend the Banquet at the end of the week also. There is a lot of choices for the competitor and I have seen people attend individual events over the years. I have seen people ONLY attend the SAW event. I have seen people attend both timed events. I have seen people attend only the specialty events. I have seen people attend only the banquet, and I have seen people attend just the heat racing.

By the way, the amount of $$$ is considerable to the host club for the timed events. Especially if everyone is allowed to run them.

Not sure why people are getting mad about a discussion, some very creative things are born out of this type discussion. Everyone has an opinion. The providing of information many times adds to their knowlege base and even changes ones mind.

I wrote a direct message to Bill Zuber indicating that if IMPBA were to look at the most successful part of the RC Hobby, we would adopt the system used by the RC Car Racers. They have a set of preliminary heats with random draw which places people in various Mains based on their performance. These preliminary heats are fun for everyone and get the racer more racing. Then they go into a Main which is based on their performance: A, B, C, D, E etc. The people who go into the C main for example race people who are of similar skill level. Those people in the A Main were the ones contesting for the World Championship (it was the Indy World Championships that I had experience with). It is a great system and one in which everyone gets challenged.

I believe that the current system used in IMPBA accomplishes the same thing, but this is a possible alternative.

Several people have indicated that the elimination of the timed events would make it just another heat race. It probably would have that effect over a gradual period of time. There is no reason for IMPBA not to try other formats, but it should be done carefully so as not to dilute the importance of the US#1 award.

Would you look at someone who won US#1 without the timed events in the same way that you look at someone who has accomplished it having to compete in the timed events. Gary Turner has a lot of important information in his reply and people should re-read it. There have been several people who have won a US#1 after many years of trying and the award really means something to them. Our hobby is so small that you will always have to explain what the placque on the wall means. It is a placque that means something to the person winning it - who cares about the mailman? :lol:

Maybe people can keep discussing this and there will some breakthrough - without getting mad if people do not accept your opinion as the only way. I can do that...... But I would like to provide an opinion based on attending MANY MANY Internats and having won some awards.

Marty Davis

Marty is very right about the way that you can enter a Internats. This format is the only one of its type that allow you to enter just the event that you want to. I have seen the people come and go at the event thru the week. US-1 is not a easy thing to win. I am looking at the only one that I have of all of these years and yes I back into that one in 1988. And if I remember right that Marty, Ackerman and their group of camp followers (just kidding Marty) blew it and it fell into my lap. In 2005 I was in control and almost had it won but lost it. Doc Turner was there to pick it up. If I am not mistaken there were no more that 100 points between the first place and the third place boats going into the straight-away trophys trials.

I have a lot of heat racing trophys. I have a lot of trophys from the Internats that I have been to over the years but I only have one US-1 trophy right now. Stu Barr has said it best. To win US-1 is to do the best driving, have the best boat, and the best luck at that moment in time.

Mark

 

[Don Ferrette]

Marty,

In the last 8 years 4 Internats have been held in district 5. Thats 50 percent of the time in recent history.

Don,

If your so pasonite about this, why dont you and your club step up to the plate and host the 2007 internats under your guidelines. Those of that race the internats are open minded enough to give your system a try if you are willing to put your money were your mouth is.

Sincerely,

Allen Waddle

We no longer (it was where it was held the 1 year in Va.) have the capability to host a big time event at the ODMBA site because the local soccer Nazi's took control of the open field area where people used to be able to park & pit, we are lucky to even fit those who come for the annual Invitational. And tell me this Allen, have YOU (not your district) ever actually been part of hosting the event? Well I have (and drove over 1400 miles round trip to do it) along side Dick Tyndall & a few other volunteers to host it in YOUR district when NOBODY stepped up so maybe YOU need to put up or shut up. So unless you have walked in my shoes you have zero room to talk about money where your mouth is. Not to mention some of you who are quoting all this integerity & tradition stuff have NEVER lifted a finger in actually hosting the Internats but are the first ones to ***** about it & how it should or should not be done. All I ever wanted by submitting the alternate format was to give more options so maybe more clubs would be interested & we wouldn't be struggling year in & year out for someone to host it. And BTW- you're **** right I'm passionate about what we do. :angry:

 

[AWaddle322]

Marty,

In the last 8 years 4 Internats have been held in district 5. Thats 50 percent of the time in recent history.

Don,

If your so pasonite about this, why dont you and your club step up to the plate and host the 2007 internats under your guidelines. Those of that race the internats are open minded enough to give your system a try if you are willing to put your money were your mouth is.

Sincerely,

Allen Waddle

We no longer (it was where it was held the 1 year in Va.) have the capability to host a big time event at the ODMBA site because the local soccer Nazi's took control of the open field area where people used to be able to park & pit, we are lucky to even fit those who come for the annual Invitational. And tell me this Allen, have YOU (not your district) ever actually been part of hosting the event? Well I have (and drove over 1400 miles round trip to do it) along side Dick Tyndall & a few other volunteers to host it in YOUR district when NOBODY stepped up so maybe YOU need to put up or shut up. So unless you have walked in my shoes you have zero room to talk about money where your mouth is. Not to mention some of you who are quoting all this integerity & tradition stuff have NEVER lifted a finger in actually hosting the Internats but are the first ones to ***** about it & how it should or should not be done. All I ever wanted by submitting the alternate format was to give more options so maybe more clubs would be interested & we wouldn't be struggling year in & year out for someone to host it. And BTW- you're **** right I'm passionate about what we do. :angry:

How soon we forget the year before you are talking about.

Allen

 

[Scott Norris]

This is a constructive conversation. :huh:

 

[Don Ferrette]

How soon we forget the year before you are talking about.

Allen

Well I was there as well in '98 & can't remember seeing you working it. I do remember Harry, Kris & some of the others bustin' thier asses though. Guess you blended into too well ........

This is a constructive conversation. :huh:

Scott you're right, there are some who just cannot accept the idea of change or trying something new & this is not worth arguing anymore ..................

 

[Twinsrule]

I have been reading this post from the get go.

This is what I have seen..... Nothing has changed in a club hosting the 07 Internats, What has transpired is guys pointing fingers who did this and that and who did not. Now times change things whetehr we want to or not it just happens we evolve and grow and learn. Maybe or maybe not changes are needed for a new format. Problem is I helped work a internat Event in Huntsville and yes it's alot of hard work and alot of dedication is involved in making one run smoothly.

Out of 6 pages of posts what have you guys accomplished? Nothing not one thing and tempers are starting to flare. Is this truely a way to conduct yourselves as adults? Has anyone stepped back from the outside and looked in and thought why do I want to be a part of this? As an outsider looking in and considering stepping back into the IMPBA after reading 6 pages of nothing it really has me thinking do I really want to be involved with such. I'm only one person and this is my view from the outside so please don't jump on me for expressing what I see within this orginization.

I have been involved in some sort of RC racing for 20 yrs and have attended some major national events and not one of these events last more than 3 days and this goes for 1/8 scale onroad racing with competitors all over the world attending.

If participants wants a change offer one and it will work and attract boaters or it won't. What have you got to loose.

As one stated some sort of race is better than no race at all.

Is this the begining of the end?

 

[Chris Wood]

twinsrule has a good point.

( I have been involved in some sort of RC racing for 20 yrs and have attended some major national events and not one of these events last more than 3 days and this goes for 1/8 scale onroad racing with competitors all over the world attending. )

what about shorting the days.. not as many heats?? might bring more people that would otherwise not go because of the amount of time and money it takes to go for a week... then again. i hate traveling 10 plus hours for a 2 day race :blink:

this is a tuff situation, on one hand we want to make it appealing for others.. on the other hand we want to keep the ROOTS of the race in check.

This may sound stupid. but what about spliting the nats up by boats.. say.. hear me out on this one..

say in july you run all mono's... have the impba mono nats..

july you have all the outboards.. say the impba outboard nats..

aug you run hydro's and scale and so on..

Just throwing out ideas.. I really don't know what would work the best, other than what we already do..

just my thoughts

chris