IMPBA proposal

[Bill-SOCAL]

Bill and others, it is clear you have your minds made up and will do what you want to regardless of the feedback you get from the FE community you are so eager to regulate, so it is fruitless to keep this discussion going.

Given your intense dedication to the ultimate in safety I am certain you will now focus your efforts onto other well known and well documented safety issues outside of FE that have in fact caused injuries and insurance claims.

 

[TERMINATOR]

Bill and others, it is clear you have your minds made up and will do what you want to regardless of the feedback you get from the FE community you are so eager to regulate, so it is fruitless to keep this discussion going.
Given your intense dedication to the ultimate in safety I am certain you will now focus your efforts onto other well known and well documented safety issues outside of FE that have in fact caused injuries and insurance claims.

hey are you the same guy that kept bugging the ama and telling them it was not a good idea to bring the impba .."of whom you are not a member of"... under their insurance umbrella?? if you are indeed and that is the good word on the street that is a shame..as you called what someone else did in a earlier post a "shame" you outta feel real proud of yourself ..as you just stated a claim about insurance issues in your post im replying too here..well impba has the best insurance they can afford without going belly up sure would have been nice to see us "all" covered under the ama and their insurance..probably would have been better for all the boating members around..what a "shame". :angry:

terry

 

[Marty Davis]

I don't understand why the FE Guys are even involved with us. They race their own races and should NEVER be included with the Nitro and Gas Races anyway.

It is amazing to me that BOTH NAMBA and IMPBA have set up so many classes now that we can't even get a good number of boats in any class. Except maybe Gas Cat.

WAY TOO MANY CLASSES!!! Will be very difficult to undo what has been done over the past several years

 

[Rigged]

It is amazing to me that BOTH NAMBA and IMPBA have set up so many classes now that we can't even get a good number of boats in any class. Except maybe Gas Cat.

huh?

Spring Nats 09 entrys in just gas classes...

Thunderboat: 24

Cracker: 15

Mono: 32

Cat: 32

Hydro: 39

Rigger: 16

Offshore: 24 (nitro included)

 

[Mark Leyde]

I don't understand why the FE Guys are even involved with us. They race their own races and should NEVER be included with the Nitro and Gas Races anyway.
It is amazing to me that BOTH NAMBA and IMPBA have set up so many classes now that we can't even get a good number of boats in any class. Except maybe Gas Cat.

WAY TOO MANY CLASSES!!! Will be very difficult to undo what has been done over the past several years

You are so right Marty. I have seen it happen in Fullsize outboard racing. To many classes offered hurts the sport as a whole.

 

[tnrcboatracer]

I've been following this as well, and keeping my mouth shut after my earlier reply. I like the idea if placing the hull on some type of towel or net. If the motor starts on it's own, the prop will be stopped, and the motor, battery, and ESC will go up in smoke. The owner might not appreciate it, but they could have put a wire loop for the retrieve boat crew to pull to prevent the issue. Once the hull goes up in smoke, we don't have to worry about it any more. Oh, and if it catches fire, toss it overboard, the pond will put it out eventually. Once concern is that the hull might jump onto the adjacent boats or go overboard when the flaming boat is tossed back, but that can't be helped. If Bill-socal is not a member of IMPBA, why is he even concerned about IMPBA rule proposals?

For those that say there haven't been any incidents yet, maybe we've just been lucky. There are many meth labs that don't blow up, but some do...........

 

[bzubee]

Thanks for all of the replies and to Mr truck pull for posting this here in the first place. It's up to the President and Exec Board now . We have have to see what happens.

 

[TRUCKPULL]

Bill Z.

You did not respond to post #58

Larry

#58

The problem remains, How many times has this happened??

Bill Z. said it happened to him when he turned off the radio battery switch.

Joe Ford from CC says: that this can happen when turning off the radio

battery switch on a CC ESC..

So maybe we should not have a radio battery switch.

Larry

 

[Don Ferrette]

The worst part is for all the ranting and raving going on here, no one has yet to explain why not to implement something like this other than "we don't want to".............. :blink:

I have been p/m'ing and emailing people who are well versed in FE to get a better understanding of what the big deal is and got a reasonable mid ground suggestion-

1. FE boats racing in FE only heats at mixed fuel events must be retrieved by FE racers.

2. FE boats racing in OPEN classes at mixed fuel events must be outfitted with Safety Loops or FE racers must retrieve the dead boats after the heat if a FE boat is dead.

Not a bad start. I'd perhaps lean towards requiring the loop on open class boats only but that's just my opinion. I personally do not see the need for it on record trial stuff at all but again that's just me.

I'm not going to fault Mr. Zuber for trying to be pro-active in terms of safety, especially now that we finally have our IMPBA insurance costs down to where they should be. I want to make a clear, well informed decision about this so let's can the "because we don't want to" attitudes and work towards a viable solution.

 

[Bob Nauss]

From what I am reading, the people against this idea basically think that since that have been no serious injuries that this is a non issue. And the people who are interested in looking at this are looking at reasonable ways to keep people from getting injured.

It seems to make sense to look at ideas that can make this a safer hobby and determine if they are reasonable, useful, and cost effective. It does not matter if they relate to gas, electric, or nitro.

Waiting for someone to get hurt before you do something is a great idea...unless you the person getting a body part chewed on by a prop.

Lawyers have gotten rich off of ideas like that.

 

[Andy Greene]

The worst part is for all the ranting and raving going on here, no one has yet to explain why not to implement something like this other than "we don't want to".............. :blink:
I have been p/m'ing and emailing people who are well versed in FE to get a better understanding of what the big deal is and got a reasonable mid ground suggestion-

1. FE boats racing in FE only heats at mixed fuel events must be retrieved by FE racers.

2. FE boats racing in OPEN classes at mixed fuel events must be outfitted with Safety Loops or FE racers must retrieve the dead boats after the heat if a FE boat is dead.

Not a bad start. I'd perhaps lean towards requiring the loop on open class boats only but that's just my opinion. I personally do not see the need for it on record trial stuff at all but again that's just me.

I'm not going to fault Mr. Zuber for trying to be pro-active in terms of safety, especially now that we finally have our IMPBA insurance costs down to where they should be. I want to make a clear, well informed decision about this so let's can the "because we don't want to" attitudes and work towards a viable solution.

Thats the best comment on this thread yet.

I must agree with the F/E guys in respect to the oval or SAWS boats- there are a few/ VERY FEW - guys that are working with some pretty aerodynamic riggers that the loop would be a hinderance (saws boats). Once again, a select few, but I'm thinking this is a very reasonable solution for all.

Andy

 

[TRUCKPULL]

I just spent 3 months building two new N2-Sport Hydros

All side panals are air tight.

The only opening in the hull is straight down from the hatch.

My decks are only1/32" ply. If you glued a plug into it and tried to

pull it out, you would rip the deck apart.

The inside of the hull is packed like a rigger.

Where do I put a pull loop?

Larry

 

[tnrcboatracer]

At the records trials I have been to, usually the boat owner heads out in the retrieve boat to pick up his dead wood. So for SAW it would probably be OK.

 

[Andy Greene]

I just spent 3 months building two new N2-Sport HydrosAll side panals are air tight.

The only opening in the hull is straight down from the hatch.

My decks are only1/32" ply. If you glued a plug into it and tried to

pull it out, you would rip the deck apart.

The inside of the hull is packed like a rigger.

Where do I put a pull loop?

Larry

Will one of your N-2 Sport Hydro's Fall into a class that Don has suggested????? :blink:

Andy

 

[Rigged]

The worst part is for all the ranting and raving going on here, no one has yet to explain why not to implement something like this other than "we don't want to".............. :blink:
I have been p/m'ing and emailing people who are well versed in FE to get a better understanding of what the big deal is and got a reasonable mid ground suggestion-

1. FE boats racing in FE only heats at mixed fuel events must be retrieved by FE racers.

2. FE boats racing in OPEN classes at mixed fuel events must be outfitted with Safety Loops or FE racers must retrieve the dead boats after the heat if a FE boat is dead.

Not a bad start. I'd perhaps lean towards requiring the loop on open class boats only but that's just my opinion. I personally do not see the need for it on record trial stuff at all but again that's just me.

I'm not going to fault Mr. Zuber for trying to be pro-active in terms of safety, especially now that we finally have our IMPBA insurance costs down to where they should be. I want to make a clear, well informed decision about this so let's can the "because we don't want to" attitudes and work towards a viable solution.

What if you are a "fueler" and dont have a problem going out to get one? We have electric guys in our club, and i have no problem ever going out and getting a boat for them.

I tend to always grab boats and place them in the retrieve boat with the bow facing me, as simple props standing still and razor sharp rudders can cut you very easy if you were to have one slide into you, or move your leg the wrong way and brush against it..

 

[Andy Greene]

The worst part is for all the ranting and raving going on here, no one has yet to explain why not to implement something like this other than "we don't want to".............. :blink:
I have been p/m'ing and emailing people who are well versed in FE to get a better understanding of what the big deal is and got a reasonable mid ground suggestion-

1. FE boats racing in FE only heats at mixed fuel events must be retrieved by FE racers.

2. FE boats racing in OPEN classes at mixed fuel events must be outfitted with Safety Loops or FE racers must retrieve the dead boats after the heat if a FE boat is dead.

Not a bad start. I'd perhaps lean towards requiring the loop on open class boats only but that's just my opinion. I personally do not see the need for it on record trial stuff at all but again that's just me.

I'm not going to fault Mr. Zuber for trying to be pro-active in terms of safety, especially now that we finally have our IMPBA insurance costs down to where they should be. I want to make a clear, well informed decision about this so let's can the "because we don't want to" attitudes and work towards a viable solution.

What if you are a "fueler" and dont have a problem going out to get one? We have electric guys in our club, and i have no problem ever going out and getting a boat for them.

I tend to always grab boats and place them in the retrieve boat with the bow facing me, as simple props standing still and razor sharp rudders can cut you very easy if you were to have one slide into you, or move your leg the wrong way and brush against it..

Being careful picking up any boat is a no brainer-sharp parts-please.

I think if your used to dealing with them(F/E boats) and you want to be an authorized person your club approves at that sanctioned race - FINE. I also have no problem with retrieving F/E - But I'm used to them.

Andy

 

[Mark Bullard]

I guess that my post #57 just blew over everyones head. It was to shock and make everyone think a little and how unreasonable it is to not do this. But if I made the FE guys a switch that could be controlled by a wire rod like a dubro switch would they buy it? I could make a very small disconnect switch that would carry a 100 amps and would have zero resistance. It would have busbars of copper to allow all the wires that you could connect to it from the batterys and on the controller. The more conductors you can parallel from the batterys to the controller will give you less resistance. And this relates to less heat.

It is a good thing that I don't want to run FE. Because I know the tricks and could make my stuff very safe. And the reason I don't run them is, I work with electric motors every day and it would not be fun for me to play with them.

 

[TRUCKPULL]

I guess that my post #57 just blew over everyones head. It was to shock and make everyone think a little and how unreasonable it is to not do this. But if I made the FE guys a switch that could be controlled by a wire rod like a dubro switch would they buy it? I could make a very small disconnect switch that would carry a 100 amps and would have zero resistance. It would have busbars of copper to allow all the wires that you could connect to it from the batterys and on the controller. The more conductors you can parallel from the batterys to the controller will give you less resistance. And this relates to less heat.
It is a good thing that I don't want to run FE. Because I know the tricks and could make my stuff very safe. And the reason I don't run them is, I work with electric motors every day and it would not be fun for me to play with them.

Mark

100A is not enough.

Some of our ESC's are HV (up to 60Volts) and 240Amps.

My N2 Sport 2S2P - 7.4Volt pulls 140Amp average over a 1 mile race.

Larry

 

[Andy Greene]

I guess that my post #57 just blew over everyones head. It was to shock and make everyone think a little and how unreasonable it is to not do this. But if I made the FE guys a switch that could be controlled by a wire rod like a dubro switch would they buy it? I could make a very small disconnect switch that would carry a 100 amps and would have zero resistance. It would have busbars of copper to allow all the wires that you could connect to it from the batterys and on the controller. The more conductors you can parallel from the batterys to the controller will give you less resistance. And this relates to less heat.
It is a good thing that I don't want to run FE. Because I know the tricks and could make my stuff very safe. And the reason I don't run them is, I work with electric motors every day and it would not be fun for me to play with them.

Mark

100A is not enough.

Some of our ESC's are HV (up to 60Volts) and 240Amps.

My N2 Sport 2S2P - 7.4Volt pulls 140Amp average over a 1 mile race.

Larry

Once again- post 74 ????

If those where the proposals would it matter to you ??

Not looking for a fight- just asking.....

Andy

 

[Mark Bullard]

I guess that my post #57 just blew over everyones head. It was to shock and make everyone think a little and how unreasonable it is to not do this. But if I made the FE guys a switch that could be controlled by a wire rod like a dubro switch would they buy it? I could make a very small disconnect switch that would carry a 100 amps and would have zero resistance. It would have busbars of copper to allow all the wires that you could connect to it from the batterys and on the controller. The more conductors you can parallel from the batterys to the controller will give you less resistance. And this relates to less heat.
It is a good thing that I don't want to run FE. Because I know the tricks and could make my stuff very safe. And the reason I don't run them is, I work with electric motors every day and it would not be fun for me to play with them.

Mark

100A is not enough.

Some of our ESC's are HV (up to 60Volts) and 240Amps.

My N2 Sport 2S2P - 7.4Volt pulls 140Amp average over a 1 mile race.

Larry

Once again- post 74 ????

If those where the proposals would it matter to you ??

Not looking for a fight- just asking.....

Andy

Not either just trying to show what could happen. On the proposals their not bad but you don't want to have a FE expert to retrieve boat at all times. I myself don't have a problem with it but you want to be able that anyone in a retrieve boat can make sure a FE boat is safe and disable when it is in the boat.

Not trying to pick at you but I would not think your boats would hit over a 100 amps on the motors. You can't put a winding in a motor the size you run to carry that kind of amps. Remember I am in the electric motor repair business and we rewind motors all the time. And I will be happy to help you all learn about motors and how to control them.