Help Me Understand

[Roger Hooks Jr.]

If it wasn't for my father i probably wouldn't have gotten as involved in this sport as I have..
chris

I tell them how much the B tunnel costs everytime, hoping they dont ask how much the twin costs. :huh:

Larry Gempp Jr.

That is a very good point! You have changed my response forever. Like many of us I want to stick my chest out and tell them about my "$3000 dollar boat". That may impress them but it also probably writes them off from even thinking about giving it a try. But now I am going to respond with the fact that they can get an entry level at one of the three Hobby Towns in the area ready to go for about $300.

It's little things like this that can make a difference.

BTW - I am also part of the JR/SR Club.

 

[Speed Jr.]

That is a very good point! You have changed my response forever. Like many of us I want to stick my chest out and tell them about my "$3000 dollar boat". That may impress them but it also probably writes them off from even thinking about giving it a try. But now I am going to respond with the fact that they can get an entry level at one of the three Hobby Towns in the area ready to go for about $300.

It's little things like this that can make a difference.

BTW - I am also part of the JR/SR Club.

Yeah, even people who are racers see how much somethin like my twin costs and say Im crazy, I can imagine how someone outside the sport must think. This is where we need to talk about how fun a class like B Stock Tunnnel is to run. Some of the best heats that I have truly had the most fun competing in is B Stock Tunnel. And good heats are much more frequent in a class like that rather than in F Hydro(at least in my area). I can honestly tell you I will be running 2 boats this upcoming season, a $3500+ Twin, and a $170 B Tunnel that I got from a Garage Sale(Im not kidding, I did find a very beat up LeeCraft at a Garage Sale for $35). If I had to pick a boat to drive for a FUN day at the pond/races, it would be the Tunnel everytime. Seriously. Running and Drivin the Twin takes a lot of work and stress, not to mention a gallon of gas every 4 runs and for sure needing a pit man. When a newbie comes up to talk to me about the twin, and see's that I am just as excited about the B tunnel, I hope he stops and thinks. I hope he see's the enjoyment Im having in the hobby, and he see's that Its not the $3500 twin that brings me this joy. I hope he see's that its the boat I got from a garage sale, and the people around me, the fellow boaters, the fellow club members, the knowledge gained from these friends, and most of all, the time spent with my father. If more people see this, more people will show up at the pond. We just need to show people that those who are already in the hobby arent better than them and arent smarter than them, cause we arent. All we need to show them is a garage sale B tunnel with the help of a new friend can win a medal on any givin sunday.

Larry Gempp Jr.

 

[Roger Hooks Jr.]

That is a very good point! You have changed my response forever. Like many of us I want to stick my chest out and tell them about my "$3000 dollar boat". That may impress them but it also probably writes them off from even thinking about giving it a try. But now I am going to respond with the fact that they can get an entry level at one of the three Hobby Towns in the area ready to go for about $300.
It's little things like this that can make a difference.

BTW - I am also part of the JR/SR Club.

All we need to show them is a garage sale B tunnel with the help of a new friend can win a medal on any givin sunday.

Larry Gempp Jr.

This is a very good message.

 

[Wesleys Custom Graphics]

Roger,One aspect that could be hurting model boating is the fact that is very labor intensive you must have a way to retrieve your dead wood it is much harder to tune a needle on a model boat than an RC car, plane, or Heli. Plus the fact that there just not that many people that enjoy tinkering with their hobbies they just want instant gratification and do not want to mess with maintenace.

I'll second this opinion. I got into the hobby because I enjoy building and tinkering, and the fact I like scale hydros.

The cost is a little more than I expected. When you first start out is overwhelming on all the info. you need to get started. It's not easy to find out how to get started. I still have to figure out how all this racing stuff works. I'll be honest I read some of the post here about the hobby shrinking and it makes me worried about getting to deep into it. I would hate to invest into my scales and not have anyone to race. I'm hoping that it turns around.

Just remember, This same conversation came up last year, just before the IMPBA had an all time new record membership. Our hobby is growing as a whole and I believe it is due to the help you get from the internet.

 

[Wesleys Custom Graphics]

He is asking $47.00 a gallon for fuel.........

And then they wonder why people go mail order or buy direct from people like FHS (Red Max). I'm all for supporting the LHS but it's not rocket science to figure out what they pay in quantity as a dealer for fuels. Yes it's a retail storefront but that guy sounds like he doesn't want your business all that bad. A smart move is to offer a decent price on stuff like fuel so you develop repeat customers who will come back to spend money. When was the last time you went to a LHS & only bought exactly what you went there for? Any other LHS in the area besides that one?

I owned a hardware store and too many people go to Home Depot to buy a water heater, then to the local hardware store to buy nickle and dime fittings. A business cant survive that way. People mail order the $200. rtr boat and expect the local guy to stock nickle and dime stuff. He can't survive that way so he charges extra for fuel and pluggs to make up for the short fall in sales. I'm not saying to support one or the other. Just saying that's why he has to do what he does.

 

[izitbrokeyet?]

Well….I promised myself that I wouldn’t drink& Post in here anymore, but new years resolutions were meant to be broken. In any case (no pun) I always feel like every post in here is potentially my last (any additional drama is explained hence).

Anyway…to answer the post directly….what’s being done right IMHO:

The positive posting and objective reasons why someone won on Saturday/Sunday. , regarding equipment , Tactics, pitman etc.

What’s being done wrong?:

Senior folks in the hobby asserting idiotic points and total disinformation to secure business for themselves. Posts on the internet that assert friends and pondmates expertise without objective info. Too many recognized classes! Too much knit-picking within existing classes and bureaucracy is killing your organizations.! Way too many people trying to support their hobby-habbit by selling products within the hobby(inflation).

Too much complaining about the price of equipment! The price is the maket price born by you the hobbiest (not controlled by some malevolent external factor). Get yourselves a clue regarding price groups/ price points or re-organize the classes into displacements of a different price range like aero speed. goup together and buy engines in groups of 50 or more, you will get recognized by the large MFG. I have to say that the price of .21 is not coming down. As it stands now, If you wanna race .21….get prepared to spend because the motors are made for another hobby that is very competitive., and is raced by folks with lots of $ resources.

Oh yea…competition my ass…..Maslow’s Heirarchy of needs states that people come to clubs for affiliation. That is somewhere betwixt belonging and esteem (esteem is achievement and respect from others) Competition is fun, but it’s not important for most. I’m sure there are others that will challenge me on this point but I guarantee they’re wrong. I guarantee that if you guys start producing affiliation within your clubs, you’ll start adding members (no more redneck societies). DUH

Plenty done wrong, not enough done right story of my life too. I know the easiest position is that of CRITIC but I figured it might be helpful to lay this upon you folks who might do something productive with this grain of salt.

 

[Rokieboater]

I think some district restructuring would be nice. Here in Namba District 20, Colorado we are somewhat isolated. We have two strong clubs but we can get tired of racing the same guys all year long. Some of us have traveled to Tucson and San Diego just to mix it up with somebody new. I would think that our District would be better off if we were in contact with New Mexico and maybe Northern Utah to draw more racers and put on bigger races. Thus promoting the hobby in our area. With the two clubs alternating on putting on the races and racing, we sometimes lack the time to talk to the people in the crowds watching.

Most of the racers here are die-hard boaters and are willing to race out of town,but these areas are out of our district and then hurts us for any year end stuff as well as taking points from those district racers.

As I have said we have travelled to other district but the reception was not that great from all the other district boaters. Some were very receptive well others were not.

 

[Glenn 787]

I think some district restructuring would be nice. Here in Namba District 20, Colorado we are somewhat isolated. We have two strong clubs but we can get tired of racing the same guys all year long. Some of us have traveled to Tucson and San Diego just to mix it up with somebody new. I would think that our District would be better off if we were in contact with New Mexico and maybe Northern Utah to draw more racers and put on bigger races. Thus promoting the hobby in our area. With the two clubs alternating on putting on the races and racing, we sometimes lack the time to talk to the people in the crowds watching.
Most of the racers here are die-hard boaters and are willing to race out of town,but these areas are out of our district and then hurts us for any year end stuff as well as taking points from those district racers.

As I have said we have travelled to other district but the reception was not that great from all the other district boaters. Some were very receptive well others were not.

I didn't notice Northern Utah being part of District 9. I think you have a good point, a restructure is in order. We'll give you Northern Utah for one RTR scale unlimited hydroplane of our choice and a 2lb bag of Oh Boy Oberto Jerky All kidding aside I like the idea....they're much closer to you.

 

[Roger Hooks Jr.]

For those of you that are active in tradeshows and other exhibitions to promote the hobby you may want to try raffling off a prize of some sort. You can use this to build a list of potential boaters. You can get your local hobby dealer interested as well if you offer him access to the same list. Just make sure you notify people on the form that they fill out to enter the raffle. You can ask for a raffle prize donation from your local dealer or if that doesn't work see if you can muster up the cash between your members to buy a raffle prize. If you have 30 members in your club or district $10 a peice should be able to get you one of the popular RTRs. You would ask people that signed up for the raffle to fill out the form completely. This will give you a point of contact to let them know about races in their area. You could even create a newsletter highlighting each race. The more shows you do the bigger your list would get. I tried this for a local hobby dealer to promote their store at an Unlimited Hydroplane race. 400 people signed up for the raffle. The problem was that he didn't have the band-width to follow up with all of them. Entering all of the information may be a chore but at least you have a targeting list of people who you have come in contact with and have shown at least some interest in the Hobby in your area.

Just some more ideas.

 

[piper_chuck]

Not sure if I've said this or not, but it's become quite obvious that we've got a big problem. Over the last month I've been trying to help two enthusiastic new boaters get hooked up with local clubs. To say it's been difficult would be an understatement. Both of them have sent emails that go unanswered. They've left phone messages that don't get returned. Recieved responses of I'm busy right now, I'll call you later, but the call never came.

They've both been left with the perception that we don't want them to participate because they chose the wrong type of boat, RTR. Why are we making it so hard for new boaters to join us? Are we putting in place some right of passage for new people to prove that they want to race bad enough that they're willing to get past all this garbage?

Note that I have taken action offline to try to fix these situations, but I've seen enough of it now to know it's not an isolated incident. All clubs should consider whether they've got the best possible person acting as their outside contact. If not, think about who would be best to help support bringing in new people, and make that one be the contact.

Sorry for the rant, but it's getting really old to keep hearing the same story over and over...

 

[Mike Larson]

Great to see the wheels turnin' Our group isnt a "club" yet, and yet we gain members a few at a time.... We're up to 6 die hards, and numerous in and out guys.... If, I could state the most important factor in gaining interest, it would be freindliness, and honesty..... When, we gain spectators, and they are there, simply smiling and saying hi commences further interest instantly..... Im not the best at it, some in our group make sure to, others wont....... one guy make it a mission..... we've welcomed hundreds of people, some jump, some dont....... Usually the first question is: did you build it? Or do you guys build these? This phrase is something you must remember....... We've a guy in our group, that, as a builder, has my utmost respect. The guy has no fear, can build anything, plans, whatever. this man will personally invite anyone to his shop in the winter months to build, discuss, and generally accomplish the overall goal of bringing new interest to the sport. This is the kicker, as, he will not build your boat for you! You will have to pay attention, use the tools, templates, glue, everything.... and, it works! Once a person accomplishes the task, and that boat rocks, they stay with us, for the most part, as it's great to see the end result of the effort..... This same guy kept my interest peaked 2 years ago, being instrumental in my achieving my first rigger builds, a task so daunting I deemed it impossible for me to do... I'm still an epoxy slopping monster, but, the maiden voyage was a resounding success, and I nearly fainted. My hat goes off to this man, he put his tunnel hull interests aside and built an inboard boat with me! At this time there are two different guys like me at his house, sawin, sandin, gluein, clampin, bringing more, and new stuff to unveil in the spring.... If, you guys have a builder in your neck, as lucky as we have been, get a kid away from the games, a spectator from the lake, maybe an airplane guy from the swap meet, over there! Build a kit! Get some plans, bring some glue! Teach, not do. When that boat rocks, they'll be around..... You guys with old stuff.... Donate it to the same person/kid that was a spectator last week at the pond... I've GIVEN( and have been given) away a half dozen hulls, and motors at various times in my short boating tenure, with a word of caution here, as, I'm batting .300 and judging character of a future boater is not one of my finer points accordingly........ some go, and some show..... Help the ones that show! If, that guy doesnt run your class, refer him to the guy that does.... Be sure to instill the support parts/equipment they'll need, as, I dont mind trading a part, etc, but, how do you actually loan a glow plug? Questions most asked of how much? Honestly saying I've got 1500 in a 21 hydro will cause 99% of people to smile and walk away.... stating you can get a RTR for 300 at the LHS priceless! How fast do you wanna go? The Vegas looks to be an awesome starter boat! Its not my H bird, by far, but, having a spectator ask me to outright sell him my fast boat isnt ethical in my mind, for the safety, the person, or the boat...... how do you start it? We gained a couple Vegas boats last year........There needs to be a one time race club waiver in every RTR box,club affiliations/directions, possibly a minimal insurance fee, and an out of the box class to support these boaters...... Cant count how many came, " help me run it" never to be seen again.... theyre either shelving it, for lack of help, money to support it, or bored with it, where, they may invest in something better/faster to keep them interested....... 50/50....... Money, is a monster factor..... not only for me, but all... I spent 1000 just on fuel, plugs, and nominal support equipment last year..... not many men with families got a grand to burn up, for sure....... I was lucky, had a good year, and motor failure was nil, or the investment grows......... I have a lotta boats, its my thing right now.... when my INTEREST fails, I'll sell out.... lotta concepts to be interested in: build, motor, props, speed...... talk with people willing here keeps my interest going....... interesting topics on the above keep me learning...... I'm here every day looking to learn, meet, talk, discuss......... I'd like to see constructive answers to my questions, for the most part, do, gaining information is my # 1 goal. HELP is the key.... From parts/hardware sources, to trimming hulls/setup, to " secrets" not easily given up, bottom line is being there for the little guys, like someone was for you......... Kev, Mark, John, Marty, old boy Don, Mikey Z and the band... you cats all know who you are .... a boater i am..... Hi, how ya doin? " Quote of the day" How much did you say that motor cost ya? good luck, and build em straight! mike

 

[Jerry Wyss]

Wow, an impressive "rant" to say the least, I tend to look at this hobby like lookin' at a hundred guy's and asking

myself "How many plumbers can we make from these hundred",, oddly enough it's few or none.

This hobby is limited in it's body of members for a reason, it's not easy. Only a few have mastered all its facets,

most are in the dark in one area or another and have to rely on others to get them thru that area. Many members

have started buisnesses for that very need.

I know at times (and they have been many) I have said to myself and others that " I must be nuts to put up with

the problems of this hobby". But its really not all that unusal, sports like tennis and golf are almost impossible to master,

ask Tiger Woods.

It's all in the person really, if you want it enough, you'll put in the effort,, besides, if you mastered it quickly, you probably

wouldn't continue in it very long either.

It's a great way to display your talents and let the "boy" in you be fulfilled and may bring the man out as well.

JW

 

[Don Ferrette]

.... stating you can get a RTR for 300 at the LHS priceless!

Out of a very, very good post a huge point to be aware of and practice. This is how you will get the new boaters. A boat that works at a decent price. Get them in, help them out, treat them with respect, get them on the water. Once the hook is set the rest takes care of itself. B)

But ..... old boy Don??

 

[David Homer]

Remember the post I made here some time back. Several years back I took it upon myself to try to get folks in the Kalamazoo MI. area interested in forming a club. To make a long story short, this was the deal. I had over 30 people on a mail/phone list, and I held monthly meetings at the LHS. Out of 30 people who showed interest, only myself and maybe 2 others had any RACING experience, or even showed any interest at all in racing. All these folks wanted was a LOCAL, INSURED, SAFE PLACE TO COME AND RUN THEIR BOATS. The toughest sell with these folks was the concept of joining a racing organization such as IMPBA just for the probable chance of securing a LOCAL site of which to safely pursue their recreation. These folks had NO desire to race, much less travel to go run their models. As we could not find a place to run, interest declined and I gave up the fight... Like I have said before our national organizations do not have a place for the recreational boater, nor do they do enough to help secure local sites. Everyone probably knows of a horror story about someone playing with an R/C boat in an unsafe place/manner and disaster occured. If we as national organizations could address this, give the non-racer a place to come and learn how to operate their models in a safe and responsible manner, much like the AMA.. maybe.. just maybe...

 

[Kez]

I don't usually join in on a thread like this but here's my 2 cents:

Most members on this forum refer to this "sport" as R/C boat racing. Often when I see a comment such as " This sport is dying" people actually meant "R/C boat racing is dying". I am one of those who does not race but enjoy building and running my boats. I call it a hobby. I have been in this hobby since 1970 and I really don;t see the popularity of this hobby diminishing. There is just not any organization that geared towards the casual boaters or non-racers.

Being a R/C boat hobbyist or enthusiast, I do not feel welcomed at most boat clubs. Recently I moved to the MA area and despite repeat attempts at trying to contact some local clubs I received no response. Hence my earlier comments on this thread that it is ironic to see a thread like this. I have met several friends on this board who are sincere to help (some even offered me engines or machining service for free) but the majority of boat clubs tend to ignore sport boaters.

I guess the point I want to make is this: R/C boat racing is a subset of a broader hobby. Making the hobby grow can only benefit the racing sector of it.

Again, just expressing my opinon. Don't flame me ;-)

kez

 

[piper_chuck]

Kez, I know where you're coming from, I've heard the same thing from others. When it comes to sport boating, do you want to do it at a club pond with other sport boaters, or are you looking to just go to the nearest lake and run your boat there. Do you like to have occasional informal races with others, or does your enjoyment just come from running your boats.

 

[Kez]

PC,

My preference would be to do it at a club pond with other sport boaters. I do enjoy the occassional informal races. When I spend months of effort and money to build a boat, I certainly would not want to risk damaging it in a race. If I were to choose between a Natinoal title or going home with my boats intact, I would go for the latter.

In the last many years, I have been going to a nearby lake alone simply because I can not locate a club close enough that would welcome sport boaters.

Another comment I often heard is that manufacturers (Picco for example) are dropping the boating products in favour of the R/C car and airplane due to a shrinking market. Most sport boaters that I have met over the years buy the very same engines, hardware, boat hulls etc just like the die hard racers do. Having sport boaters in the hobby can only help the racing facet of it grow.

kez

 

[Jerry Wyss]

PC,My preference would be to do it at a club pond with other sport boaters. I do enjoy the occassional informal races. When I spend months of effort and money to build a boat, I certainly would not want to risk damaging it in a race. If I were to choose between a Natinoal title or going home with my boats intact, I would go for the latter.

kez

Just a little note kez, you really live in a world where insurance is a must incase of an accident. Hobby boaters have

been on the 5 o'clock news at times and uninsured accidents can cause serious damage to our sport/hobby.

Even the sanctioned organized model boating clubs have hit the news at times but they exist under many requirements

of insurance, sanctioning body and rules under they're specific organizations with approval of local authority.

Now I don't like all the rules and insurance anymore than the next guy, but I can "only imagine" the kaos that could insue

with a Large group of hobby boaters. Damage to a boat is one thing, damage to ones body can be something entirely

different and could end everybodys fun in one accident. Just a thought.

JW

 

[Tom Kelly]

Kez

We were discussing this very topic at our club meeting last night. We have club members who do not race, but are required to be an IMPBA member to run on the pond when other members are there. Also, if a new guy wants to run his RTR boat at the pond, he has to become an IMPBA member to satisfy the liability insurance.

It would be nice to have a system in place to accomodate these people so they can get there "feet wet" in our hobby/sport with the help of our club members. I liked the idea of a one day waiver to help promote the hobby.

m larson has the right idea, "$300 RTR at your LHS, priceless!"

Tom

 

[Mike Betke]

KezWe were discussing this very topic at our club meeting last night. We have club members who do not race, but are required to be an IMPBA member to run on the pond when other members are there. Also, if a new guy wants to run his RTR boat at the pond, he has to become an IMPBA member to satisfy the liability insurance.

It would be nice to have a system in place to accomodate these people so they can get there "feet wet" in our hobby/sport with the help of our club members. I liked the idea of a one day waiver to help promote the hobby.

m larson has the right idea, "$300 RTR at your LHS, priceless!"

Tom

Tom,

Does it really matter for you guys in the Transom Twisters? According to KR Joye in the races and results forum, your club (Transom Twisters) is not accepting new members. How does a new guy get his feet wet when he is not even allowed to participate?