Thunder Boat Rules

[Hydro Junkie]

I know this is all crazy, but as the IMPBA president said to me yesterday I spoke with him at the spencer park D-2 race sunday, The RCMK EVO is NOT legal for a SS class engine, so as of now thats what stands.

If that is the case, it needs to be added PROMINENTLY to the rules so that these kinds of "debates" are not needed. Just out of curiosity, is there anything in writing to verify this as I know many won't accept word of mouth. Just to make this perfectly clear, I am not disputing Larcor69's or any other person's post. I'm just asking where this has been documented so there are no questions

 

[BDM Racing]

I know this is all crazy, but as the IMPBA president said to me yesterday I spoke with him at the spencer park D-2 race sunday, The RCMK EVO is NOT legal for a SS class engine, so as of now thats what stands.

If that is the case, it needs to be added PROMINENTLY to the rules so that these kinds of "debates" are not needed. Just out of curiosity, is there anything in writing to verify this as I know many won't accept word of mouth. Just to make this perfectly clear, I am not disputing Larcor69's or any other person's post. I'm just asking where this has been documented so there are no questions

YES it should be spelled out in plain english and published, instead of the way its presented. The way it is written now, it does not mention any engine that is legal, maybe naming the engines (by name and manufacture will be more simple

 

[Don Ferrette]

The new soon to be launched IMPBA website will have everything there. The are problems with the current site that cannot be fixed including certain areas that we can no longer access to update. It's a long, boring story not even worth the keystrokes at this point but an entirely new site has been under construction and will be far superior to what is currently in place including things like being able to do membership apps on line as well as voting on proposals. It will be done right and will be worth the monumental effort being put for right now in it's construction. We are almost there, please hang in there a little longer.

 

[BlueBlaster]

Aside from the rules that are in question the way I see it is like NASCAR with restricted plates and such they have to be equel and the motors that are availible give a fair field so it becomes how good are your racing skills , Dale earnhart didn't win cause his engine was so much better he had the skill to find a way up front. If there is a motor that superior then others then it's not much of a race. Now when the other gas motor can be equel to the evo then you may see that one allowed . Yes it's a stock motor and I see the conflict but it's like saying I have a stock V8 but the other is a stock V8 with turbos. If the evo out classes the other so much then it would be unfair to the others until the other motors can catch up. Racing is just as much skill then just being faster. Just the way I see it without the bigger issue .

 

[ww29]

i just have question.i dont want it to get out of hand.does the decals have to be a specific size on the boat?i want to get into this class next year.

 

[Wesleys Custom Graphics]

i just have question.i dont want it to get out of hand.does the decals have to be a specific size on the boat?i want to get into this class next year.

The rules are very similar to the sport 40 class. It just has to resemble a race boat. Not any specific year or vintage.

 

[ww29]

thanks for the help

 

[Bruce Jacobs]

In response to the post about the officials at Hobart allowing the evo motor to run in the Thunder boat class, I as the CD do not have time to police all the classes to see what motors are being ran, and from what I hear some are running modified Zenoah motors in that class anyway. I also hear about guys running 80 piston/liners in their scale boats, I also didn't check the bore on the stock tunnel class carbs either. There is cheating going on in all forms of racing and if you feel the need to cheat to win and you get away with it, you have to live with yourself. If I start running a class that I think someone is not following the rules, I will put down my money and have them torn down to expose them to the whole world and then we will all know about it. So to solve some of this, maybe we need to tech the motors prior to the race and seal the case, then see who has the best boat. Or just throw out all the supposed stock classes and go race boats. Lets appoint a motor czar to go to all the races just to teardown motors and ban the cheaters for life. Face it guys, stock is not going to be able to be enforced.

 

[kcvnd]

I also hear about guys running 80 piston/liners in their scale boats

Deplorable :angry: This is the kind of stuff that takes the fun out of it all in my opinion.

 

[fishinghole]

In response to the post about the officials at Hobart allowing the evo motor to run in the Thunder boat class, I as the CD do not have time to police all the classes to see what motors are being ran, and from what I hear some are running modified Zenoah motors in that class anyway. I also hear about guys running 80 piston/liners in their scale boats, I also didn't check the bore on the stock tunnel class carbs either. There is cheating going on in all forms of racing and if you feel the need to cheat to win and you get away with it, you have to live with yourself. If I start running a class that I think someone is not following the rules, I will put down my money and have them torn down to expose them to the whole world and then we will all know about it. So to solve some of this, maybe we need to tech the motors prior to the race and seal the case, then see who has the best boat. Or just throw out all the supposed stock classes and go race boats. Lets appoint a motor czar to go to all the races just to teardown motors and ban the cheaters for life. Face it guys, stock is not going to be able to be enforced.

Pretty good observation there Bruce. Here's whats bothering me in this class. You evidently have guys that are cheating knowing there isn't a tech inspector at races. All it took was that first guy to break the rules and the rest of them follow to be competitive. They don't look at it as cheating because the first guy is getting away with it. They just plain don't want to get beat. It's called racing and having the most competitive equipment is what it'a all about. If your going to have or run a stock class in any IMPBA race then there should be a tech inspector or inspectors. The IMPBA rule book implies there will be during Sport 20 tunnel races. If you don't, as you said, it's not going to be completely stock and people are going to break the rules. It's a hard pill to swallow when you've done everything possible to follow the rules and you see a guy getting the hardware at the end of the event who has won with a illegal motor. Second, as I've stated earlier, there is nothing the IMPBA membership voted on in the final vote that prohibits any factory stock 26cc motor from being run in this class. All of a sudden individuals are making the decission as to what is and is not a legal 26cc stock motor. I've looked up every possible rule on motors in this class and the restriction doesn't excist. If they want this class restricted to certain motors then put it out for a membership vote. If I'm wrong here, please show me where this was voted on by the membership. As of right now, I've put a complete hold on getting into this class because of all of this. I may at some point just build the boat and put in my choice of a factory stock 26cc motor and run it for the pure enjoyment of it. I thought thats what this was all about in the beginning anyway??

 

[P THOMAS]

In response to the post about the officials at Hobart allowing the evo motor to run in the Thunder boat class, I as the CD do not have time to police all the classes to see what motors are being ran, and from what I hear some are running modified Zenoah motors in that class anyway. I also hear about guys running 80 piston/liners in their scale boats, I also didn't check the bore on the stock tunnel class carbs either. There is cheating going on in all forms of racing and if you feel the need to cheat to win and you get away with it, you have to live with yourself. If I start running a class that I think someone is not following the rules, I will put down my money and have them torn down to expose them to the whole world and then we will all know about it. So to solve some of this, maybe we need to tech the motors prior to the race and seal the case, then see who has the best boat. Or just throw out all the supposed stock classes and go race boats. Lets appoint a motor czar to go to all the races just to teardown motors and ban the cheaters for life. Face it guys, stock is not going to be able to be enforced.

Pretty good observation there Bruce. Here's whats bothering me in this class. You evidently have guys that are cheating knowing there isn't a tech inspector at races. All it took was that first guy to break the rules and the rest of them follow to be competitive. They don't look at it as cheating because the first guy is getting away with it. They just plain don't want to get beat. It's called racing and having the most competitive equipment is what it'a all about. If your going to have or run a stock class in any IMPBA race then there should be a tech inspector or inspectors. The IMPBA rule book implies there will be during Sport 20 tunnel races. If you don't, as you said, it's not going to be completely stock and people are going to break the rules. It's a hard pill to swallow when you've done everything possible to follow the rules and you see a guy getting the hardware at the end of the event who has won with a illegal motor. Second, as I've stated earlier, there is nothing the IMPBA membership voted on in the final vote that prohibits any factory stock 26cc motor from being run in this class. All of a sudden individuals are making the decission as to what is and is not a legal 26cc stock motor. I've looked up every possible rule on motors in this class and the restriction doesn't excist. If they want this class restricted to certain motors then put it out for a membership vote. If I'm wrong here, please show me where this was voted on by the membership. As of right now, I've put a complete hold on getting into this class because of all of this. I may at some point just build the boat and put in my choice of a factory stock 26cc motor and run it for the pure enjoyment of it. I thought thats what this was all about in the beginning anyway??

Bruce I can see your pain, Impba has not done much to make your CD job easy, There are go no go guage for the sport outboard engines but are there measurements or guidelines in place for checking the stock gas motors?

Impba does have a protest rule if a racer has to use it but a little intimidation by stating a teardown for the winner by race cd would probally keep the outlaws at bay, If there were any.

Who was supposed to be running a evo rcmk?

I am just dumb I guess, but if a club runs a class with special IMPBA rules, maybe the cd should be prepared to enfocre the rules. There were CD's and DIstrict directors, Gas directors, tech director and IMPBA Prez at the race.

 

[Denis Tomicki]

Only been to one race! Sooo?

How often is there a visual inspection?

How often does a tear down after a race happen?

 

[SayMikey]

Only been to one race! Sooo?

How often is there a visual inspection?

How often does a tear down after a race happen?

Not often enough,most clubs have 10 or so members so its not a high priority. Look at the Hobart race 5 -7 people putting on a race with 275 plus boats. The only downfall of this race was lack of rounds everything else far exceeded racers expectations making this a very successful event.Want to go next year? you better be ready to get your entry in soon as the flyer hits

 

[Douglas P Shepherd]

Only been to one race! Sooo?

How often is there a visual inspection?

How often does a tear down after a race happen?

Not often enough,most clubs have 10 or so members so its not a high priority. Look at the Hobart race 5 -7 people putting on a race with 275 plus boats. The only downfall of this race was lack of rounds everything else far exceeded racers expectations making this a very successful event.Want to go next year? you better be ready to get your entry in soon as the flyer hits

In Hobart I ran a RMCK-EVO in my Zip Kit thunderboat hull (as per myself and a corporate lawyer read the rules) nowhere in the rules could we find any wording that stated that an RCMK Evo engine (which is a box stock motor) was not legal. The way the rules are stated (as many us have read over and over) is that it has to be a box stock motor. (period) I ordered the motor pulled it out of the box and put it in my thunderboat. Many days leading up to Hobart myself and many club members were out at the pond and I ran my thunderboat with a stock ZEN. and on a brand name GPS it ran 55.6 mph. After installing the RCMK Evo and after running about 3 or 4 tanks of fuel though it it ran a consistant 56.7mph. A little over a mile an hour faster. In no way shape or form do I feel like I'm a cheater in any IMPBA class. I run, I build my hulls and race them as per the way the rules are put on paper. So if the IMPBA are going to make the rules (which I have no problem with) make them a lot more clearer. Don't just put them in the Rooster Tail where 25% of the american people don't have access to a computer. I RUN BY THE RULES ...... Doug Shepherd Madison,In

 

[fishinghole]

Only been to one race! Sooo?

How often is there a visual inspection?

How often does a tear down after a race happen?

Not often enough,most clubs have 10 or so members so its not a high priority. Look at the Hobart race 5 -7 people putting on a race with 275 plus boats. The only downfall of this race was lack of rounds everything else far exceeded racers expectations making this a very successful event.Want to go next year? you better be ready to get your entry in soon as the flyer hits

In Hobart I ran a RMCK-EVO in my Zip Kit thunderboat hull (as per myself and a corporate lawyer read the rules) nowhere in the rules could we find any wording that stated that an RCMK Evo engine (which is a box stock motor) was not legal. The way the rules are stated (as many us have read over and over) is that it has to be a box stock motor. (period) I ordered the motor pulled it out of the box and put it in my thunderboat. Many days leading up to Hobart myself and many club members were out at the pond and I ran my thunderboat with a stock ZEN. and on a brand name GPS it ran 55.6 mph. After installing the RCMK Evo and after running about 3 or 4 tanks of fuel though it it ran a consistant 56.7mph. A little over a mile an hour faster. In no way shape or form do I feel like I'm a cheater in any IMPBA class. I run, I build my hulls and race them as per the way the rules are put on paper. So if the IMPBA are going to make the rules (which I have no problem with) make them a lot more clearer. Don't just put them in the Rooster Tail where 25% of the american people don't have access to a computer. I RUN BY THE RULES ...... Doug Shepherd Madison,In

Sorry but I have to ask, how would you feel now if the rules were rewritten and the Evo was not a legal motor not based on membership votes? I think your comparison shows that there really is no great advantage to this motor speed wise. Thanks for your input.

 

[Douglas P Shepherd]

Only been to one race! Sooo?

How often is there a visual inspection?

How often does a tear down after a race happen?

Not often enough,most clubs have 10 or so members so its not a high priority. Look at the Hobart race 5 -7 people putting on a race with 275 plus boats. The only downfall of this race was lack of rounds everything else far exceeded racers expectations making this a very successful event.Want to go next year? you better be ready to get your entry in soon as the flyer hits

In Hobart I ran a RMCK-EVO in my Zip Kit thunderboat hull (as per myself and a corporate lawyer read the rules) nowhere in the rules could we find any wording that stated that an RCMK Evo engine (which is a box stock motor) was not legal. The way the rules are stated (as many us have read over and over) is that it has to be a box stock motor. (period) I ordered the motor pulled it out of the box and put it in my thunderboat. Many days leading up to Hobart myself and many club members were out at the pond and I ran my thunderboat with a stock ZEN. and on a brand name GPS it ran 55.6 mph. After installing the RCMK Evo and after running about 3 or 4 tanks of fuel though it it ran a consistant 56.7mph. A little over a mile an hour faster. In no way shape or form do I feel like I'm a cheater in any IMPBA class. I run, I build my hulls and race them as per the way the rules are put on paper. So if the IMPBA are going to make the rules (which I have no problem with) make them a lot more clearer. Don't just put them in the Rooster Tail where 25% of the american people don't have access to a computer. I RUN BY THE RULES ...... Doug Shepherd Madison,In

Sorry but I have to ask, how would you feel now if the rules were rewritten and the Evo was not a legal motor not based on membership votes? I think your comparison shows that there really is no great advantage to this motor speed wise. Thanks for your input.

I am for what ever makes the class grow and the most competive. I also know that there are many factors to racing. More power does not always produce more speed. There are Three factors to boat racing . Engine ,Hull and Props. it takes all three to make a great racer but not just one will make you the fastest boat on the water. So for the IMPBA to set the guidelines for the class and make it the most. We have to look at all three. Just as there are engines that may be a factory there are also hulls and props that can do the same. I can have CNC props for my scale that run 5 to 6 MPH faster over ANTHING you will buy or bend with the same engine in my scale boat. So what I am saying is it is not all about the engine or the prop or the hull. IT IS ALL THREE as a hole!! Doug Shepherd

 

[P THOMAS]

Only been to one race! Sooo?

How often is there a visual inspection?

How often does a tear down after a race happen?

Not often enough,most clubs have 10 or so members so its not a high priority. Look at the Hobart race 5 -7 people putting on a race with 275 plus boats. The only downfall of this race was lack of rounds everything else far exceeded racers expectations making this a very successful event.Want to go next year? you better be ready to get your entry in soon as the flyer hits

In Hobart I ran a RMCK-EVO in my Zip Kit thunderboat hull (as per myself and a corporate lawyer read the rules) nowhere in the rules could we find any wording that stated that an RCMK Evo engine (which is a box stock motor) was not legal. The way the rules are stated (as many us have read over and over) is that it has to be a box stock motor. (period) I ordered the motor pulled it out of the box and put it in my thunderboat. Many days leading up to Hobart myself and many club members were out at the pond and I ran my thunderboat with a stock ZEN. and on a brand name GPS it ran 55.6 mph. After installing the RCMK Evo and after running about 3 or 4 tanks of fuel though it it ran a consistant 56.7mph. A little over a mile an hour faster. In no way shape or form do I feel like I'm a cheater in any IMPBA class. I run, I build my hulls and race them as per the way the rules are put on paper. So if the IMPBA are going to make the rules (which I have no problem with) make them a lot more clearer. Don't just put them in the Rooster Tail where 25% of the american people don't have access to a computer. I RUN BY THE RULES ...... Doug Shepherd Madison,In

Thanks Doug, I thought so much hoopla over that motor was BS, maybe to get some intrest in the new motor. IMPBA could do some real tests to confirm what you have already seen before ruling out this motor.

Boat setup and tunning is important. I first ran my Zipp boat at 49-50, went back and modded the sponsons and worked on props and now it runs 55-56 all the time with the stock Z260.

 

[fishinghole]

I agree 100% Phil.

J. Pflueger

 

[Douglas P Shepherd]

Only been to one race! Sooo?

How often is there a visual inspection?

How often does a tear down after a race happen?

Not often enough,most clubs have 10 or so members so its not a high priority. Look at the Hobart race 5 -7 people putting on a race with 275 plus boats. The only downfall of this race was lack of rounds everything else far exceeded racers expectations making this a very successful event.Want to go next year? you better be ready to get your entry in soon as the flyer hits

In Hobart I ran a RMCK-EVO in my Zip Kit thunderboat hull (as per myself and a corporate lawyer read the rules) nowhere in the rules could we find any wording that stated that an RCMK Evo engine (which is a box stock motor) was not legal. The way the rules are stated (as many us have read over and over) is that it has to be a box stock motor. (period) I ordered the motor pulled it out of the box and put it in my thunderboat. Many days leading up to Hobart myself and many club members were out at the pond and I ran my thunderboat with a stock ZEN. and on a brand name GPS it ran 55.6 mph. After installing the RCMK Evo and after running about 3 or 4 tanks of fuel though it it ran a consistant 56.7mph. A little over a mile an hour faster. In no way shape or form do I feel like I'm a cheater in any IMPBA class. I run, I build my hulls and race them as per the way the rules are put on paper. So if the IMPBA are going to make the rules (which I have no problem with) make them a lot more clearer. Don't just put them in the Rooster Tail where 25% of the american people don't have access to a computer. I RUN BY THE RULES ...... Doug Shepherd Madison,In

Thanks Doug, I thought so much hoopla over that motor was BS, maybe to get some intrest in the new motor. IMPBA could do some real tests to confirm out what you have already seen before ruling out this motor.

Boat setup and tunnig is important. I first ran my Zipp boat at 49-50, went back and modded the sponsons and worked on props and now it runs 55-56 all the time with the stock Z260.

I myself just as Bruce stated. I did not go around a look to see what everybody in the Thunderboat class was running. But I do know that myself and Phil ran almost side by side for 6 laps with nobody having a clear advantage. So two Evo's or a Evo and a Zen. It was great racing hand down !!!

 

[Douglas P Shepherd]

Only been to one race! Sooo?

How often is there a visual inspection?

How often does a tear down after a race happen?

Not often enough,most clubs have 10 or so members so its not a high priority. Look at the Hobart race 5 -7 people putting on a race with 275 plus boats. The only downfall of this race was lack of rounds everything else far exceeded racers expectations making this a very successful event.Want to go next year? you better be ready to get your entry in soon as the flyer hits

In Hobart I ran a RMCK-EVO in my Zip Kit thunderboat hull (as per myself and a corporate lawyer read the rules) nowhere in the rules could we find any wording that stated that an RCMK Evo engine (which is a box stock motor) was not legal. The way the rules are stated (as many us have read over and over) is that it has to be a box stock motor. (period) I ordered the motor pulled it out of the box and put it in my thunderboat. Many days leading up to Hobart myself and many club members were out at the pond and I ran my thunderboat with a stock ZEN. and on a brand name GPS it ran 55.6 mph. After installing the RCMK Evo and after running about 3 or 4 tanks of fuel though it it ran a consistant 56.7mph. A little over a mile an hour faster. In no way shape or form do I feel like I'm a cheater in any IMPBA class. I run, I build my hulls and race them as per the way the rules are put on paper. So if the IMPBA are going to make the rules (which I have no problem with) make them a lot more clearer. Don't just put them in the Rooster Tail where 25% of the american people don't have access to a computer. I RUN BY THE RULES ...... Doug Shepherd Madison,In

Thanks Doug, I thought so much hoopla over that motor was BS, maybe to get some intrest in the new motor. IMPBA could do some real tests to confirm out what you have already seen before ruling out this motor.

Boat setup and tunnig is important. I first ran my Zipp boat at 49-50, went back and modded the sponsons and worked on props and now it runs 55-56 all the time with the stock Z260.

I myself just as Bruce stated. I did not go around a look to see what everybody in the Thunderboat class was running. But I do know that myself and Phil ran almost side by side for 6 laps with nobody having a clear advantage. So two Evo's or a Evo and a Zen. It was great racing hand down !!!

But here we go Phil you stated and I stated that are hulls run 55 to 56 MPH. The Blazer hull out of the box with a stock Zen260 will run 57mph. By no words am I running down Brains hull . Brain has done so mush for the RC gas class were could we stop. But what I am say is that I have spent alot of time working with sponsons and props and skid fins with the Zip that 55 to 57 in the stock form is about it. So hand down the Blazer hull is 5 mph faster than the Zip in the stock form. So even the RMCK-EVO in the Zip can not get it to the 60mph range with the BLazer hulls. The Zip kit is a fine easy to build myself and my two son had alot of fun building it. Just as it was ment to be fun. The bottom line here is that there will always be a better mouse trip and if you want to pay to get there then go for it. But to say with out testing that the EVo engine will put you out front evey time them I think you are wrong. I was at Hobart with alot of GREAT racers and I the thunderboat class I had a EVO in my hull and a Blazer hull came out on top with a stock engine whatever Brian was running!!! Engine is only 1/3 of it!!! If that