P Ltd/Spec Batteries?

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NW, SE, East, West Coast... The Midwest is where the parties at. :)
I'll second that neighbor!!! I have one request, bring the chick pictured in your signature to the MN Champs. Rumor has it she likes running the retrieve boat in a teeny weeny bikini!
 
What are the batteries of choice, besides Hyperion?

TL
I just bought my first set of Dinogy's and will be running them this weekend in my new FE scale. If they go like I've heard from others they may be the new mark to beat. B)
I run Thunder Power R/C packs, but also run the Dinogy's in one boat. Thus far, the Dinogy's have proven to be quite good. Time will tell if they hold up as long as my Thunder Power packs have, but so far, so good. If they make it a second season, they'll be pretty solid if you are on a budget.
 
Oh - and by all means try and travel to a couple races out of your District. Doesn't matter if your IMPBA, NAMBA or crosseyed. We have a crap load of fun.

Doug

WORD on that!! I'm REALLY looking forward to meeting many of you next June!!
 
Different country, but "p-spec" has got alot of people over to run one when they normally only do nitro or gas. It has been great over here and we run it as a "gentlemens agreement" no rule change needed. If someone rocks up with a neu powered boat, then good on them, we will have fun anyway!

Plenty of bench racers these days, put your money where your mouth is!

Entropy batteries are working well over here, my last hyperion pack never seemed to perform very well...previously they had though.
 
Hi,

haven't read the whole tread ,i want to aske you ,have you ever thought about a energie limiter like Steve Neu and SM Modellbau Have in there product folio. I want to start a limiter class in Germany ,but that's not easy. Some want it ,some want design by them selve and some are happy with no limiter. I talked with Steve Neu as i want a Limiter for boatracing that only reduce speed to 70% after the limit is reached as the modelairplane limiter shut of after limit.But planes can glide and boats do rest in the water becoming a danger underwater croco for the other racing boats stil under way. My question ,what do you think about a world wide boatracing Limiter class ?

The Electronic equipment is here and tested since years in the modelairplane class f5b and f5d pylon. Test show that powersystems life for years with a limiter and the coast of a limiter is with 50 bucks not over the horizon.
 
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The topic has been discussed..... IMO, the use of electronic limiters would only result in the need for motors whose power parameters are specifically designed to be used with limiters. So much for cost reduction..... :rolleyes:
 
Can't believe that the minority thinkers (SE) are so loud in their pursuit of trying to push their position. Not just a very small minority position Nationally but also in your own back yard. You guy's may want to step back - take a breath - and rethink a couple times before you post. Oh - and by all means try and travel to a couple races out of your District. Doesn't matter if your IMPBA, NAMBA or crosseyed. We have a crap load of fun.
Doug

What makes you think Doug, Chris Harris and myself are the minority thinkers in the IMPBA? An internet popularity contest doesn't exactly make for an accurate representation of what the majority of the IMPBA membership is in favor of. Especially when half those responding are NAMBA members. Truthfully, we have only heard opinions from a handful of IMPBA members in a few districts. The only thing we are pushing is letting local areas run the Limited class to suit it's membership., And by the way, we are not any louder than the other dozen people who have been hashing over the same argument year after year. Here is the bottom line. Talking on the board about the same thing year after year is not going to get anything done except cause bad blood between people who would probably otherwise enjoy each other's company racing boats together. So I invite Tim or anyone else to submit a proposal to their District Director. I'll support compliance in my district with any nationally approved Limited class. I'll be looking for a proposal in the next Roostertail.
 
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Well here we go.

I haven't read any real arguments on any forum for quite some time now. I have read some good discussions and alot of regurgitated issues. The fact is, is that on just about every thread that has to do with P-Limited someone from the South East is throwing digs at the rest of the Country about foolishly burning up equipment followed by a serious of smilely faces and Youtube videos. Along with this we continue to get promotions to spec esc's, props and detuning suggestions so we can run with nitro. The broken record crap slinging has really wore itself out. And the detuning suggestion to run with nitro is just not going to see the light of day anywhere but your Districts.

IMPBA and even NAMBA are membership organizations. They are not dictatorships controlled by a handfull of guy's that carry some sort of little title. I would suggest that a little smoother communication with the membership would go a lot further than presenting the dillusion of hierarchy. It is this hierarchy that is keeping IMPBA from implementing a National rule set for P-Limited. You fellows had a rule set ready a couple years back with spec-ed esc's and found out you would not get the votes to pass it. Get rid of this and it will pass. I know this will be hard as there will have to be some egos set aside. The general membership will be happy. Your Nitro/electric combined District can still continue to run spec-ed esc's and detuned boats.

It is unfortunate in your part of the country there is not enough nitro boats to run a class and or not enough electrics to run a class and therefore have to mix them. And it also unfortunate in your area that nitro still looks down on electric. The problem is, is that this is not really the case anywhere else. In the Midwest we are growing quite well. Looks like we will be up to almost 12 P-Limited Tunnels and maybe 12 P-Limited Mono's between D4 and D6 next year. We are growing because nitro guys are quite facinated with the speed and competitveness of our electric racing. Some are actually intimated and will not go electric. If for some reason our electric guy's miss a race we are cussed out for not attending. They want us there.

Next June the NAMBA Nationals are in Michigan (home of the largest attended Electric Nationals in the US). This will be attended by the best heat racing drivers around. Many of these electric guys will have more than 20 years of electric boat racing experience. This is within a good drive for you East Coast guys. Seize the oppurtunity!

Doug
 
agree 100 percent doug about dropping the spec esc....its what keeps me from racing in atl

I race down at ft pearce fl with the wave blasters spring race...we have a lot of p spec boats and classes...even have fe skiff class that's a blast....in fact if I am not wrong they have more boats and racers then the 2012 nats did....
 
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agree 100 percent doug about dropping the spec esc....its what keeps me from racing in atl

I race down at ft pearce fl with the wave blasters spring race...we have a lot of p spec boats and classes...even have fe skiff class that's a blast....in fact if I am not wrong they have more boats and racers then the 2012 nats did....
That's a great idea. I've been talking to some guys about running electric in D14. There are none that I'm aware of and hopefully we will have 7 next year along with maybe 2 Q sport boats . I think making it easier will get more interested. Just limit the rules to the battery's.
 
The Pacific northwest has years of experimenting with electric boats. The various groups have different goals for their style of racing. Scale guys want to concentrate on imitating full size boats with little emphasis on power plant development. This shows in the nitro, gas, and electric racing rules. Others want to limit powerplant experimentation but allow development in propellers and hulls. They run P spec and similar rules. All out electric racers run the full NAMBA rules where only the battery is limited.

The ultimate case of this is in full sized boats where, at present, only the motor type (brushed) and battery voltage is limited. Developing a fast boat within these limitations was a serious engineering and development job. There was a very large input from model racers since at that time (2007) lithium polymer batteries were very new. The fact that this record, set in 2008, still stands shows the caliber of the effort.

Some of the same electric model boat racers are quitely upping model records through their continued development. Those results will trickle down to the limited classes and give hobby racers a fun, but much less expensive experience. Continued rule revisions will be needed and the advance in technology makes better performance available from low cost components. Great, moderate cost large motors are starting to become available. It was already pointed out that the Turnigy Marine 120 is a good, low cost speed control. The 20C Enerland batteries we ran in 2008 were state of the art at that time. Now 45 (actual) C batteries with much less internal resistance are moderate cost. Even premium batteries are reasonably priced, and, in my opinion, worth it.

Let's spend time thinking about what the minimum restrictions need to be to achieve the goals of the majority of people racing particular boats. I promise this will change as time passes, but cost will still be proportional to the current draw.

Lohring Miller
 
Lot's of good discussion happening... thread seems back on the right track. :)

Perfect Cost will still be proportional to the current draw.
That's what makes limiters attractive. Otherwise some part of the system, as Darin pointed out, is the fuse. The current attempts to limit current at a given voltage are:

1. Length limits - result in boats too small to handle well, but turn out to be about right for P spec power.

2. Specified motors - result in the motor being the fuse (an $80 one for NAMBA P limited rules)

3. Specified motor and ESC - either or both are the fuse, a more expensive option since the UL-1 motor and ESC fail at around the same current

4. Maximum propeller diameter (RCU electric rules) - puts emphasis on prop development and component efficiency - won't necessarily result in low cost components

5. Spec propellers (used by our club for UL-1 and Super V27) - very equal racing with stock hulls but boaters can't stand not fiddeling with SOMETHING

6. Combinations of the above - RCU tried spec motors and max prop diameter, 1/7 scale electrics use spec motors and props, NAMBA P limited uses length limits and spec motors

Why not address the proplem directly with current limiters. They cost less than motors and nothing except for egos gets damaged with over current. Maybe lower cost components are as efficient as high cost ones when they are run at reasonable currents.

Lohring Miler
 
Or, we could just build the boats from cookie-cutters, and install auto-pilots. Then we wouldn't have to tune for the power, OR drive them properly, at all... Nothing would be risked ever again... :p

I've never seen a power system... Gas... Nitro... or Electric, that could be tuned beyond it's functional limits... Never meat one that didn't have to be either...

Not a big fan of adding additional electric components, especially when some of us have MANY boats we'd have to outfit with it.

I'm just not sure WHY this extra complication is necessary, when a simple understanding of the system, a little tuning knowledge/experience, and an acceptance of the "risk" involved (something sorely missing in our society today in general!), would be more than adequate to resolve any issues...

"Illegal heat shrink" is not the separating factor between 1st and the rest of the group, most likely... Or the difference between a setup that has lasted for two seasons, vs. one that burned up last time out... after only 3-runs... <_<
 
... That being said, however, if, as a group, we tested and approved WHATEVER rules... I would happily abide by them. I just want to go race boats... legally and fully within the rules... :)

If it gives people a perceived "comfort", and gets them out racing, then I can live with it, even if it doesn't really make any sense... :)
 
Hi,

this are the one and only limiter , http://www.neumotors.com/Site/Energy_Limiters.html .

Every can build his owen dreams ,but has to look for high efficancy . no Bad idea to train future boat racers.

only prop or current or size will easy overcome . In Germany we have a limited boat class they limit ,prop size,batterie waight,and you have to buy a motor and esc combo (cheap Lehner motor and esc (Schulze )now other) . Very narrow racing .Also the hull has to be a production hull everybody can buy . No Prototyp boat allowed.
 
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