P Ltd/Spec Batteries?

[Chilli]

I take it those are NAMBA Clubs. What classes do those club run Ron? Do they run races by themselves or hook up with other IC clubs??

 

[HTV Boats]

West Florida hasn't had an event yet. Waveblasters have an annual FE spring race on their 1/4 mile, 8 lap course. Nice site but few full P or Q there. The NAMBA district here has little interest in FE. We have had some spec tunnels in the IC events. Brandon's tunnel only race has Pspec, P, Q. run among the nitro classes. A few club events run open classes where we can run. District points races are two day events and mostly gassers. FE would have to pick a class they could support and show up on a regular basis to be acknowledged and included. Not likely. Club one days if we get enough to make a class we are usually accommodated. Mostly from nitro tunnel crossovers as the true FE racers aren't in the loop for the most part.

Mic

 

[ron upton]

like mic said west fla hasent had an event but I know of 5 or 6 s/t mon o's and prob 10 q cats in the membership

 

[Darin Jordan]

Mic,

No disrepect intended, but you are seriously over-blowing the having to buy a lot of motors deal. Way over blowing it...

But, we have to race what people are racing, right? A good chunk of the people racing FE today would NOT be racing at all had we not gotten the P-Ltd rules in place.

The FE club here, Puget Sound Fast Electric Model Boat Club races P-Ltd classes exclusively nowadays... P-Mono was contested, but eventually that dried up too. People got tired of killing batteries and ESCs.

There is ALWAYS a fuse in the system... Push any of the technology to it's limits, which IS the point of racing, after all, and someone is going to experience a failure.

There just aren't enough racers in the pool of talent out there who have the desire to put the development time, maintenance time, and MONEY, into the more "open" setups. We WERE doing that, and were racing in classes of 3-4 people. It's much more exciting for all involved to have 12 entries in P-Ltd Sport,, etc... and have some real competition, even it you are a bit slower, and have a bit more fragile motors (again, debatable...)

What we DO avoid is the reality that, with OPEN rules, SOMEONE is going to show up and rock the "boat" with a newer, faster, more expensive motor, that instantly obsoletes everything currently running. We've lived that for years. Now, we don't. It's a trade-off.

And, you guys mentioned the deal where clubs are self-limiting the motors, etc... Just another form of "Limited" racing... there is a reason they are doing that, and it's not all about cost...

 

[Darin Jordan]

Oh, I forgot to mention that NAMBA D8, Puget Sound Model Boat Club (Jerry Dunlap and the gang) do also offer two FE classes. P-Ltd OPC Tunnel and P-Ltd Hydro. Attendance there is just OK...

The fact of the matter is that many (most) FE guys are CHEAP! They don't want to pay $300.00 for a Neu Motor. They see two motors that look about the same... One a Neu, the other a Chinese copy for $95.00, and they will always choose the later.

Not sure why that is, but it's a regular pattern.

There also isn't a real culture of "building", or even tinkering with setups, modding existing boats, etc... Most want to bolt in the power system, have someone tell them what prop is the "best" and then go out there an go 65mph... for 10 minutes...

That's part of the reason why I try to post build threads, setup information, etc... There just aren't enough of us out here to hide information from. We need to spread it so more will get involved.

 

[Doug Smock]

The FE club here, Puget Sound Fast Electric Model Boat Club races P-Ltd classes exclusively nowadays... P-Mono was contested, but eventually that dried up too. People got tired of killing batteries and ESCs.

There is ALWAYS a fuse in the system... Push any of the technology to it's limits, which IS the point of racing, after all, and someone is going to experience a failure.

Did anyone ever figure out why they were killing batteries and ESCs?

Perhaps you fellas should take notes from the guys in the SE.

 

[Darin Jordan]

Did anyone ever figure out why they were killing batteries and ESCs?

Perhaps you fellas should take notes from the guys in the SE.

Pffft!

The same reason they are buring up P-Ltd setups... Asking way to much, from too little, without a full understanding of the system... :blink:

Especially that little thingy hanging off the back... B)

 

[Darin Jordan]

Oh... that... and the fact that they hadn't discovered the illegal heat-shrink trick yet... :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[HTV Boats]

Darin, No offense taken. In my sarcasm I was trying to point out that limited classes that could be stepping stones to unlimited classes are just finding another hull style to put a limited motor in.

I laugh when you say FE racers are cheap. I just think that but don't want to offend anyone. Coming from years of nitro and scrap boxes of blown cases. cranks, sleeves and pistons my view of costs are skewed. I will cheap out as much as I can, but hate throwing money away. I have a pile of Tacons, leopards,TP & HK motors etc. that for another $100-150 a motor would still be running. Knock on wood haven't smoked a Neu or Castle yet. (a work in progess). As you pointed out anything can go up in smoke with too much prop for too long. Let alone improper soldering, wiring or water.

Keep the build info going. Sharing info and ideas doesn't cost anything. Might be a couple FE guys east of me but I am pretty much as far south as you get.

Mic

 

[lohring]

Our tiny club is about to put on its 23rd annual Emerald Cup. We've run monthly races in the summer as well. We started with nitro only, moved into a mix of nitro and gas, and now run a mix of nitro, gas, and P spec electric. Before the P spec boats there was no interested in electric. Now it's threatening to replace nitro, especially in the smaller sizes. As Darren said, there's interest in Q spec sport 40 with my existing boat joined by several new builds. I can't see that happening with unlimited systems. Unlimited power plant design takes both engineering knowledge and experimentation. Most hobby boaters don't have the knowledge, time, or money. The ones who do (you know who they are) dominate the records and racing. The spec concept levels the playing field.

Lohring Miller

 

[raptor347]

Did anyone ever figure out why they were killing batteries and ESCs?

Perhaps you fellas should take notes from the guys in the SE.

Thanks Doug, yet another positive comment from the IMPBA records coordinator. The funny smileys don't help. OK, we got it. You guys do it all right and we do it wrong. Take the broken record off the turn table, this one's been playing too long. This type of comment is the main reason some of the most experienced FE guys don't post info anymore.

And yes we did figure out why we were hurting parts. We don't hurt them any more. Enough said.

 

[ron upton]

you can share secrets with me anytime brian...my boats need all the help I can get....I must say though smock did help me set up the worlds most expensive 60a esc (forced on me or couldn't run in there ball park)and really knew what he was doing ... thanks again doug

 

[Doug Smock]

Wow Brian that was a stretch :huh: And BTW, I am a toy boat racer first. I do the other jobs because I was asked.

Glad you got it sorted out. B)

You're welcome Ron, always ready to help as you saw.

You fellas have fun!

 

[Chilli]

Unlimited power plant design takes both engineering knowledge and experimentation. Most hobby boaters don't have the knowledge, time, or money. The ones who do (you know who they are) dominate the records and racing. The spec concept levels the playing field.

So you are telling us the consensus among your group is the majority of FE boaters accross the country are finanically incapable of and not knowldgeable enough to participate in anything other than limited classes. Wow. With that attitude, no wonder only Limited classes are sucessfull in your area. Maybe you should contact the guys in NAMBA 1 and let them know they are doing it all wrong. I congratulate you all for finding what works in your area. I have formula that works in mine but I will not push the IMPBA to impose it on the rest of the membership.

 

[Darin Jordan]

Unlimited power plant design takes both engineering knowledge and experimentation. Most hobby boaters don't have the knowledge, time, or money. The ones who do (you know who they are) dominate the records and racing. The spec concept levels the playing field.

So you are telling us the consensus among your group is the majority of FE boaters accross the country are finanically incapable of and not knowldgeable enough to participate in anything other than limited classes. Wow. With that attitude, no wonder only Limited classes are sucessfull in your area. Maybe you should contact the guys in NAMBA 1 and let them know they are doing it all wrong. I congratulate you all for finding what works in your area. I have formula that works in mine but I will not push the IMPBA to impose it on the rest of the membership.

Come on, man... do you really want to take it there?? You are WAY off base.

I would have to say that here in the NW, we have quite a LARGE concentration of FE boat racers... probably one of the highest in the country, so you might consider that we do have a LITTLE bit of experience with this...

Lohring, or I, did NOT say that anyone was an idiot, or incapable of anything... The fact of the matter is that a large majority of the boaters out there are at the "hobbiest" level, and race as such. This is an extra activity for them, not a lifestyle, and, as such, many don't want to make the investment into equipment and resources that it would take to completely competitive in an "Open" format.

It's not like we haven't been through this here... My first three years of RC boat racing, I had to completely... COMPLETELY, replace my fleet, because technology was changing faster than I could build boats. It got VERY expensive and almost made me quite. This isn't like NItro, where you guys run the same boat for YEARS... Everytime a new motor, or ESC, or battery pack/chemistry was introduced, everything else became obsolete in a hurry. Adapt, or die.

The limited format offers a more stable level of techonolgy, so people's investments are protected. It's a good thing.

The fact is that there are BOTH levels on the rulebook, so what are we arguing about here? If you have enough racers in your area to run Q-Mono... Or open P-Mono, go for it... Takes 3 here to make a class.

When they stopped being built, we stopped running it. That's why we have clubs... you build and race what everyone else agrees to build and race.

 

[Tim leyde]

What are the batteries of choice, besides Hyperion?

TL

 

[Don Ferrette]

What are the batteries of choice, besides Hyperion?

TL

I just bought my first set of Dinogy's and will be running them this weekend in my new FE scale. If they go like I've heard from others they may be the new mark to beat. B)

 

[JoeWScott]

I'm running a dinogy 4s 5000mah in my JAE. 15 cycles and it hasn't skipped a beat. Seems to balance perfectly and has come back to same voltage every time I've charged it.

 

[raptor347]

GrimRacer, Dinogy, Hyperion. All three work very well and last if cared for.

 

[SeanKewley]

NW, SE, East, West Coast... The Midwest is where the parties at.