what size/type of motor/ESC etc. for conversion of 60 sized rigger to FE?

[Don Ferrette]

Like the title says what would be the best choices for motor/ESC/battery components to convert a 60 sized outrigger to a strong FE boat? What FE class would it run in?

 

[longballlumber]

Like the title says what would be the best choices for motor/ESC/battery components to convert a 60 sized outrigger to a strong FE boat? What FE class would it run in?

Don I would look into a Q set up. That would be 2X 6S Lipos. The Neu Motors are the way to go. I would think you would have a couple of choices 1527/1Y or the 1527/1.5D. Going to 6S you will probably want to go with an HV (High Voltage) Controller. A Castle Creations Hydra HV180 should cover both of those setups assuming you don't over prop them. The 1Y motor is 1,250 RPM/Volt and would be more on the conservative side compared to the 1.5D motor 1,500 RPM/Volt.

The tough part is getting all of the “stuff” packaged into a typical Nitro built rigger. Typically you will find the motor in the rear of the hull (near the front of radio box), and the batteries and controller towards the front. If you lucky the tub would be wide enough to get the batteries side by side and then put the controller in-between the two (batteries and motor), all the while maintaining your COG. The best scenario would be to have all of those components in your hand and build/modify a hull that can hold them.

Later,

Mike Ball

http://www.castlecreations.com/support/documents/neumotors-castle_boat_apps.pdf

 

[Don Ferrette]

"The tough part is getting all of the “stuff” packaged into a typical Nitro built rigger."

Thanks for the advice Mike. I think the "tough part" is more like getting past the $1300+ price tag sticker shock for a motor, ESC and 2 battery packs. Then one still needs chargers, balancers, spare battery sets, etc. And some say nitro is expensive to run..... :blink:

 

[longballlumber]

a strong FE boat?

There are other routes that you can go buy getting a "budget" speed control and "budget" Lipos. When I gave you the suggestions that I listed above I was trying to adheare to your suggestion of "Strong"

http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=hef-sword-240hv

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10304&Product_Name=Turnigy_4000mAh_6S_40C_Lipo_Pack

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10332&Product_Name=Turnigy_Monster-2000_200A_4-12S_Brushless_ESC

Later,

Mike

 

[Don Ferrette]

a strong FE boat?

There are other routes that you can go buy getting a "budget" speed control and "budget" Lipos. When I gave you the suggestions that I listed above I was trying to adheare to your suggestion of "Strong"

http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=hef-sword-240hv

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10304&Product_Name=Turnigy_4000mAh_6S_40C_Lipo_Pack

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=10332&Product_Name=Turnigy_Monster-2000_200A_4-12S_Brushless_ESC

Later,

Mike

It's all good Mike, if I build one I wouldn't go "budget". We all know that usually winds up as another way to say buy it twice.

 

[Mike Luszcz]

Personally, I would steer clear of the Castle Hydra HV series controllers as they are 90% smoke bombs. If you are running a 6s2p setup, I would look into either the new Turnigy 240A HV controller or the Swordfish 240aHV controller (both the same controller with different labels), or the Castle ICE 200a ESC which is the ESC I am using in my Executone 1/8th scale on 6s2p with a NEU 1527 1Y 1250kv motor. Let me know if you decide to take that plunge Don and I will help you all I can with what and where to get the items. Also, I would like to do a similar rigger setup, just didn't know if there would be a class for it. I wanted to convert one of the JAE hulls. Mike Luszcz

 

[Kris Flynn]

Shultze 40-160...although it alone is $700+ (last time I Checked) LOL

 

[TinoAlmanza]

Mr. Ferrette I know you are asking about a .60 rigger but if I could suggest stepping down to a .21 size you could do a "spec" one for a third of that price. Folks are in the 60s now and it's FE's biggest up and coming class. Here is a link to one of them.

JAE FE in spec running gear.

 

[Don Ferrette]

The tough part is getting all of the “stuff” packaged into a typical Nitro built rigger. Typically you will find the motor in the rear of the hull (near the front of radio box), and the batteries and controller towards the front. If you lucky the tub would be wide enough to get the batteries side by side and then put the controller in-between the two (batteries and motor), all the while maintaining your COG. The best scenario would be to have all of those components in your hand and build/modify a hull that can hold them.

How wide and tall would you recommend a Q rigger tub be? Would 4" inside to inside and 2" tall be enough?

 

[Don Ferrette]

Mr. Ferrette I know you are asking about a .60 rigger but if I could suggest stepping down to a .21 size you could do a "spec" one for a third of that price. Folks are in the 60s now and it's FE's biggest up and coming class. Here is a link to one of them.

JAE FE in spec running gear.

I'm well aware of the P-spec class, just ask my D12 FE guys.

 

[moparbarn]

Mr. Ferrette I know you are asking about a .60 rigger but if I could suggest stepping down to a .21 size you could do a "spec" one for a third of that price. Folks are in the 60s now and it's FE's biggest up and coming class. Here is a link to one of them.

JAE FE in spec running gear.

I'm well aware of the P-spec class, just ask my D12 FE guys.

yeah, they're giving us a FIT!! a fe jae is first in b hydro in d-12, and an ob sundowner is in second. both of us are rigger newbies, what is this class coming to ????? maybe this is what obama meant by diversity LOL

 

[TinoAlmanza]

Mr. Ferrette I know you are asking about a .60 rigger but if I could suggest stepping down to a .21 size you could do a "spec" one for a third of that price. Folks are in the 60s now and it's FE's biggest up and coming class. Here is a link to one of them.

JAE FE in spec running gear.

I'm well aware of the P-spec class, just ask my D12 FE guys.

yeah, they're giving us a FIT!! a fe jae is first in b hydro in d-12, and an ob sundowner is in second. both of us are rigger newbies, what is this class coming to ????? maybe this is what obama meant by diversity LOL

LOL ok. Well at least we are doing pretty good from the sounds of it. :lol:

 

[lohring]

We run P spec hydros in the Pacific Northwest. They are a great replacement for 3.5 hydros. Next year we plan to develop a Q spec class to be similar to 7.5 powered boats. The principle for both classes is to keep costs down with low amp motors and speed controls. A Q spec boat would run a motor like this: http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=fei-580-L&cat=116 and the whole system should cost less than a 7.5 inboard engine. Battery costs should be similar to nitro fuel costs. Speeds should be as good as nitro (The P spec boats go 65+) and reliability is much better.

Lohring Miller

 

[Don Ferrette]

So is Q equivalent to a .45 or a .67/80 sized boat?? Looking at the Castle website a 40"+ scale would be an S or a T-

http://www.castlecreations.com/support/documents/neumotors-castle_boat_apps.pdf

:unsure:

 

[longballlumber]

So is Q equivalent to a .45 or a .67/80 sized boat?? Looking at the Castle website a 40"+ scale would be an S or a T-

http://www.castlecreations.com/support/documents/neumotors-castle_boat_apps.pdf

:unsure:

Don,

Perhaps we should have started here; how long is the hull your trying to convert (length of boat without hardware installed)? In other words, tip of front sponsons to trailing edge of rears or to the tub transom if that is the furthest distance. To be in the "Q" Class you must be 40" or under. Again the problem is stuffing all of that stuff into a nitro purpose built hull. In most cases the tub height isn't tall enough...

When you start trying to outfit an "S" and "T" boat you’re talking about running a 2P configuration for batteries. That means 4 packs in one boat +motor +controller. I have seen a "T" rigger 10S set up in a "gas" sized boat.

Out of the NAMBA Book

HULL LENGTH MEASUREMENTS

a) Hulls in each class will not exceed the length given in the following table:

Class Maximum Length

M-2 N/A

N-1 N/A

N-2 27”

O 27”

P 34”

Q 40”

S 60”

T 60”

 

[longballlumber]

We run P spec hydros in the Pacific Northwest. They are a great replacement for 3.5 hydros. Next year we plan to develop a Q spec class to be similar to 7.5 powered boats. The principle for both classes is to keep costs down with low amp motors and speed controls. A Q spec boat would run a motor like this: http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=fei-580-L&cat=116 and the whole system should cost less than a 7.5 inboard engine. Battery costs should be similar to nitro fuel costs. Speeds should be as good as nitro (The P spec boats go 65+) and reliability is much better.

Lohring Miller

I do agree with Lohring in this aspect... I like the idea of SPEC'ing a motor. If you can spec the motor it keeps cost and performace under control. The way FE tries to limit their classes is by hull length and voltage. There is no limitation to the motor winds, motor diameter, motor length.... etc...

 

[Darin Jordan]

We run P spec hydros in the Pacific Northwest. They are a great replacement for 3.5 hydros. Next year we plan to develop a Q spec class to be similar to 7.5 powered boats. The principle for both classes is to keep costs down with low amp motors and speed controls. A Q spec boat would run a motor like this: http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/proddetail.php?prod=fei-580-L&cat=116 and the whole system should cost less than a 7.5 inboard engine. Battery costs should be similar to nitro fuel costs. Speeds should be as good as nitro (The P spec boats go 65+) and reliability is much better.

Lohring Miller

I do agree with Lohring in this aspect... I like the idea of SPEC'ing a motor. If you can spec the motor it keeps cost and performace under control. The way FE tries to limit their classes is by hull length and voltage. There is no limitation to the motor winds, motor diameter, motor length.... etc...

I think spec'ing a SINGLE motor is a pain in the ass and not a good way to go. Specing a LIST of motors, as we currently do in FE (hopefully officially sometime this winter), is the way to go, because not all hulls work with the same motors. You need a range of motors, which will allow more freedom with the hulls. The motors should have generally the same design and mass, etc., just like the current P-Spec/Limited stuff, and there should be a mechanism to allow new motor offerings to be dropped in, like P-Limited hopes to do in the official ruleset.

I also tend to agree with Lohring in another aspect, and that's that, with spec'd power parameters, we could do without the length limits... NOT that it would really matter that much with our current power systems.

Voltage is simply used to define classes... it's not being used as a "limiting" factor for anything.

 

[Don Ferrette]

So is Q equivalent to a .45 or a .67/80 sized boat?? Looking at the Castle website a 40"+ scale would be an S or a T-

http://www.castlecreations.com/support/documents/neumotors-castle_boat_apps.pdf

:unsure:

Don,

Perhaps we should have started here; how long is the hull your trying to convert (length of boat without hardware installed)? In other words, tip of front sponsons to trailing edge of rears or to the tub transom if that is the furthest distance. To be in the "Q" Class you must be 40" or under. Again the problem is stuffing all of that stuff into a nitro purpose built hull. In most cases the tub height isn't tall enough...

When you start trying to outfit an "S" and "T" boat you’re talking about running a 2P configuration for batteries. That means 4 packs in one boat +motor +controller. I have seen a "T" rigger 10S set up in a "gas" sized boat.

Out of the NAMBA Book

HULL LENGTH MEASUREMENTS

a) Hulls in each class will not exceed the length given in the following table:

Class Maximum Length

M-2 N/A

N-1 N/A

N-2 27”

O 27”

P 34”

Q 40”

S 60”

T 60”

Ok the rigger hull I'm looking at has a 38" tub that is 4" wide inside to inside with an inside working height of 2 1/8" in the engine bay. The overall length from front sponson tip to rear sponson trailing edge is 42".

 

[speakerboy]

Don ,,

Jerome here .. i am just like you building up a 6s rigger in the same size as yours .. i dont know if my setup will meet the limmits of the race classes you run there , but i bought a a turnigy 180 amps esc for less than 100 bucks , and a feigao 580 long motor with watercooling for about 125 bucks , than a couple of 6S zippy packs 5000h 40c for 90 buck a piece .. that will do it for a start , and than i might work my way up for a neu motor ore something like that .. but it can be cheap and still not real bad quality .

the Jae 21 is a blast to built and even there its fast ...! i am building up a upscaled model of that one with some more design in a 6S model ..

jerome !

 

[Don Ferrette]

Hey guys I truly appreciate all the input, feel I'm getting somewhere on the learning curve at least. I do like the lower cost of the bigger 6-S stuff Jerome laid out as P-spec speeds aren't really gonna keep my interest peaked for long since I run the bigger nitro stuff. I am intrigued though and do want to give it a go so keep that info coming!