Frustrated

[Chuck Spragg]

Hey guys . I owne a 94 Bud Tri-wing 1/8 scale boat from Thunderboat Reproductions. Boat was org. built by Dick Casperi, boat weighed in at 12 pounds dry. It had front radio box with engine set as far forward as it could, with 2 8 oz. fuel tanks mounted in left and right wings, At that time I was using OPS 67 for power. With no sucess,boat wanted to lift off water and blowover, I started with strut depth at 1-1/8 inch from bottom of center tub, down to over 1-1/4 inch,with plenty of neg. angle to the point the tail of boat begins to hop, I have tried props Ranging from x455 to x460 2 and 3 blades with boat still blowing off. Since then, Now I have a CMB 67 for power and rear radio box and the boat weighs in at 13 pounds dry. It has 20 oz. metal tank up front, boat weighs over 14 pounds wet. Still same results.blowovers,blowers,blowers. does anyone out there owen one ,If so please let me know what is wrong with this boat and or setup... Thank Chuck

 

[shoboat]

Chuck,

Sorry to hear about your problem, I think a lifting propeller will help you out however.

I would try a 1457/3 to start with and see how that works first.

Good Luck Testing,

Mark Sholund

 

[ALLAN YUEN]

h34r: Possibly bend turn fin with bracket so check up make sure parellel level

better contact to Don Ferrette . He will help you how to set up Good Luck!

 

[Chuck Spragg]

Chuck,

Sorry to hear about your problem, I think a lifting propeller will help you out however.

I would try a 1457/3 to start with and see how that works first.

Good Luck Testing,

Mark Sholund

Thanks Mark, I will send money for one tommorow

h34r: Possibly bend turn fin with bracket so check up make sure parellel level

better contact to Don Ferrette . He will help you how to set up Good Luck!

Thanks Allan ,turn fin is parellel

 

[SayMikey]

Chuck,

Sorry to hear about your problem, I think a lifting propeller will help you out however.

I would try a 1457/3 to start with and see how that works first.

Good Luck Testing,

Mark Sholund

Thanks Mark, I will send money for one tommorow

h34r: Possibly bend turn fin with bracket so check up make sure parellel level

better contact to Don Ferrette . He will help you how to set up Good Luck!

Thanks Allan ,turn fin is parellel

yep try a 1457 and let me know the outcome i have a t-4 almost ready for paint

 

[brandonclan]

It sure looks good doin it though!!!! You'll get it under control......I have faith in ya man!!

Just slow down and let me pass!!! That way you won't blow over See ya soon!

Dan

 

[Don Ferrette]

Hey guys . I owne a 94 Bud Tri-wing 1/8 scale boat from Thunderboat Reproductions. Boat was org. built by Dick Casperi, boat weighed in at 12 pounds dry. It had front radio box with engine set as far forward as it could, with 2 8 oz. fuel tanks mounted in left and right wings, At that time I was using OPS 67 for power. With no sucess,boat wanted to lift off water and blowover, I started with strut depth at 1-1/8 inch from bottom of center tub, down to over 1-1/4 inch,with plenty of neg. angle to the point the tail of boat begins to hop, I have tried props Ranging from x455 to x460 2 and 3 blades with boat still blowing off. Since then, Now I have a CMB 67 for power and rear radio box and the boat weighs in at 13 pounds dry. It has 20 oz. metal tank up front, boat weighs over 14 pounds wet. Still same results.blowovers,blowers,blowers. does anyone out there owen one ,If so please let me know what is wrong with this boat and or setup... Thank Chuck

First off, where is the balance point for the hull?? Talking about props is pissin' in the wind if the hull's balance point is way off. <_<

 

[Chuck Spragg]

Hey guys . I owne a 94 Bud Tri-wing 1/8 scale boat from Thunderboat Reproductions. Boat was org. built by Dick Casperi, boat weighed in at 12 pounds dry. It had front radio box with engine set as far forward as it could, with 2 8 oz. fuel tanks mounted in left and right wings, At that time I was using OPS 67 for power. With no sucess,boat wanted to lift off water and blowover, I started with strut depth at 1-1/8 inch from bottom of center tub, down to over 1-1/4 inch,with plenty of neg. angle to the point the tail of boat begins to hop, I have tried props Ranging from x455 to x460 2 and 3 blades with boat still blowing off. Since then, Now I have a CMB 67 for power and rear radio box and the boat weighs in at 13 pounds dry. It has 20 oz. metal tank up front, boat weighs over 14 pounds wet. Still same results.blowovers,blowers,blowers. does anyone out there owen one ,If so please let me know what is wrong with this boat and or setup... Thank Chuck

First off, where is the balance point for the hull?? Talking about props is pissin' in the wind if the hull's balance point is way off. <_<

Your right DON , I,ll have balance point in about 30 minutes, boat is not at my house . will post it shortly Thanks Don . Chuck

It sure looks good doin it though!!!! You'll get it under control......I have faith in ya man!!

Just slow down and let me pass!!! That way you won't blow over See ya soon!

Dan

Nothing quite like it, see you this weekend for more speed secerctes. More speed More speed More speed Chuck

 

[Mark Stein]

Boat was airing out nicely... just before it pointed at the sky.

Mark

 

[Mark McCray]

Chuck,

You have a picture of this boat?

Mark

 

[missbudpilot55]

Owning a Caspari T-4 I found that the rear wing plays very key roll in how the boat runs I added an ajustable linkage to the rear edge of the trailing edge of the horizonal wing so that I can hold either a positive or negative angle on the wing, it will work very well. That said also recheck your turn fin, even though mine showed to be square it did move when the boat was running causing the right sponson to lift.

When I finish with the rebuild (sponsons canoes popping apart) I am going to replace it with a Dick Tyndell turn fin, I know that it won't flex or bend, my boat with a front radio box, tanks in the wings, CMB Cam 67 weighed in at 12 1/4 lbs. Another key factor on this hull is that all wings for and aft must be set at zero degrees of incidence or the hull has some very strange traits.

 

[Chuck Spragg]

Hey guys . I owne a 94 Bud Tri-wing 1/8 scale boat from Thunderboat Reproductions. Boat was org. built by Dick Casperi, boat weighed in at 12 pounds dry. It had front radio box with engine set as far forward as it could, with 2 8 oz. fuel tanks mounted in left and right wings, At that time I was using OPS 67 for power. With no sucess,boat wanted to lift off water and blowover, I started with strut depth at 1-1/8 inch from bottom of center tub, down to over 1-1/4 inch,with plenty of neg. angle to the point the tail of boat begins to hop, I have tried props Ranging from x455 to x460 2 and 3 blades with boat still blowing off. Since then, Now I have a CMB 67 for power and rear radio box and the boat weighs in at 13 pounds dry. It has 20 oz. metal tank up front, boat weighs over 14 pounds wet. Still same results.blowovers,blowers,blowers. does anyone out there owen one ,If so please let me know what is wrong with this boat and or setup... Thank Chuck

First off, where is the balance point for the hull?? Talking about props is pissin' in the wind if the hull's balance point is way off. <_<

Balance points are 21 1/2 ins. from rear sponsons and 19 1/2 ins. from transom , 26 ins. front tip of sponsons. Do you know where this boat balance point should be ? Thanks for the help. Chuck

Owning a Caspari T-4 I found that the rear wing plays very key roll in how the boat runs I added an ajustable linkage to the rear edge of the trailing edge of the horizonal wing so that I can hold either a positive or negative angle on the wing, it will work very well. That said also recheck your turn fin, even though mine showed to be square it did move when the boat was running causing the right sponson to lift.

When I finish with the rebuild (sponsons canoes popping apart) I am going to replace it with a Dick Tyndell turn fin, I know that it won't flex or bend, my boat with a front radio box, tanks in the wings, CMB Cam 67 weighed in at 12 1/4 lbs. Another key factor on this hull is that all wings for and aft must be set at zero degrees of incidence or the hull has some very strange traits.

Do you mean same degree? or do you mean flat as in putting straitedge on both front and rear wings Thanks, Chuck

Chuck,

You have a picture of this boat?

Mark

Mark Yes I do have some photos of her

Boat was airing out nicely... just before it pointed at the sky.

Mark

Mark Stein, Just like the first 50 times before that one. I,m thinking of renaming her Miss Skywalker.

Owning a Caspari T-4 I found that the rear wing plays very key roll in how the boat runs I added an ajustable linkage to the rear edge of the trailing edge of the horizonal wing so that I can hold either a positive or negative angle on the wing, it will work very well. That said also recheck your turn fin, even though mine showed to be square it did move when the boat was running causing the right sponson to lift.

When I finish with the rebuild (sponsons canoes popping apart) I am going to replace it with a Dick Tyndell turn fin, I know that it won't flex or bend, my boat with a front radio box, tanks in the wings, CMB Cam 67 weighed in at 12 1/4 lbs. Another key factor on this hull is that all wings for and aft must be set at zero degrees of incidence or the hull has some very strange traits.

She has a very stout turnfin, Boat runs strait and true till 30 mph then bye bye for the sky.

 

[Don Ferrette]

Chuck, I owned A Caspari T-4 & what Bill is saying is true, the 2 pair of ram wings need to have a zero angle of attack. Your balance point need to be about 2 inches behind the back vertical edge of front sponsons, I had to add a significant amount of weight inside both sponsons to get my T-4 hull balanced. As for the turn fin it MUST be dead parallel to the sponson running surfaces. If you can send me a picture of the turn fin & also a side pic of hull on a flat set up board, send to [email protected]. I'll look at it this evening when I get home. We've got an issue here & it ain't a prop problem.

 

[Joe Wiebelhaus]

Chuck,

first of all it's a 2 wing, not a tri wing

the hull design is a P.O.S. (scale wise)

your driving it like a Sport 40, trying to catch me!

enough of the humor (Chuck and I know each other well)

Clamp on an alum angle to the strut (48" long) and verify that it is truely paralell with the sponsons.

add weight, I could never figure out why ANY Bud 2 wing boat spends more time in the air then on the water, it's a vented hull, its longer, its..... its like some one made a POS and every one copied it, the rear sponsons on any Bud 2 wing are way too shallow, and yet (on a real unlimited) they are there for rear support and to prevent the boat from blowing over???? Add weight

Now dont get me wrong, they are fast, but never on the water. add weight

I have seen at least 6 different Bud 2 wing hulls over the past 10 years in district 2, and they all have the same tendency to ride extreamly light (add weight), and blow over.

Have fun Chuck, (add weight) wish I was there to observe your frustration.

B)

Oh, did I mention to add weight ?

 

[Don Ferrette]

I might be wrong but I think Joe might be trying to say add weight ...... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I'll disagree with a T-4 being a POS scale wise, it's just a different animal that needs some taming.

I would also go back to the front radio box & stuff a pair of Sullivan 10oz slant/oval tanks back in the front wings. B)

 

[Mike McKnight]

Buddy of mine had a 2-Wing Exide several years ago that was a Baker hull and it had the same issue. His problem though was that the forward ram wing had too much angle to it and he kept adding weight and it would still blow off.

I have a 2-Wing hull by Bert Dygert that I have not finished yet but I've been told from others that I know that have had similar hulls that they are a different animal. A guy I know in Washington had one and he said his ran great in the straights but always had issues with the tail of the boat sagging in the turns. Even Bert told me he had that issue with his until he played with strut angle and props a bit.

 

[Joe Wiebelhaus]

Buddy of mine had a 2-Wing Exide several years ago that was a Baker hull and it had the same issue. His problem though was that the forward ram wing had too much angle to it and he kept adding weight and it would still blow off.

I have a 2-Wing hull by Bert Dygert that I have not finished yet but I've been told from others that I know that have had similar hulls that they are a different animal. A guy I know in Washington had one and he said his ran great in the straights but always had issues with the tail of the boat sagging in the turns. Even Bert told me he had that issue with his until he played with strut angle and props a bit.

Bert Dygerts 2 wing is a different animal, it dosent have the same scale design flaw the others have, especially with the rear sponsons, drop those rear sponsons and you might get to the root of the problem.

(blow overs, sagging in the turns)

B)

ps, Mike, I have moved, and will not be able to vacuum form the canopys for your BD 2-wing, sar....

 

[Mike McKnight]

Buddy of mine had a 2-Wing Exide several years ago that was a Baker hull and it had the same issue. His problem though was that the forward ram wing had too much angle to it and he kept adding weight and it would still blow off.

I have a 2-Wing hull by Bert Dygert that I have not finished yet but I've been told from others that I know that have had similar hulls that they are a different animal. A guy I know in Washington had one and he said his ran great in the straights but always had issues with the tail of the boat sagging in the turns. Even Bert told me he had that issue with his until he played with strut angle and props a bit.

Bert Dygerts 2 wing is a different animal, it dosent have the same scale design flaw the others have, especially with the rear sponsons, drop those rear sponsons and you might get to the root of the problem.

(blow overs, sagging in the turns)

B)

ps, Mike, I have moved, and will not be able to vacuum form the canopys for your BD 2-wing, sar....

No biggie Joe. I have some of my own Vac gear now and I'm making them myself. I needed to do it for that boat and my conventional Exide too. By the way....any word from Bert since he moved?

 

[Joe Wiebelhaus]

Buddy of mine had a 2-Wing Exide several years ago that was a Baker hull and it had the same issue. His problem though was that the forward ram wing had too much angle to it and he kept adding weight and it would still blow off.

I have a 2-Wing hull by Bert Dygert that I have not finished yet but I've been told from others that I know that have had similar hulls that they are a different animal. A guy I know in Washington had one and he said his ran great in the straights but always had issues with the tail of the boat sagging in the turns. Even Bert told me he had that issue with his until he played with strut angle and props a bit.

Bert Dygerts 2 wing is a different animal, it dosent have the same scale design flaw the others have, especially with the rear sponsons, drop those rear sponsons and you might get to the root of the problem.

(blow overs, sagging in the turns)

B)

ps, Mike, I have moved, and will not be able to vacuum form the canopys for your BD 2-wing, sar....

No biggie Joe. I have some of my own Vac gear now and I'm making them myself. I needed to do it for that boat and my conventional Exide too. By the way....any word from Bert since he moved?

Mike,

Nope, I saw Bert over the Holidays (December), then I also relocated to Florida, surprised he didnt race in Atlanta last weekend.

 

[missbudpilot55]

I'll throw this out for open discussion and I will be talking to Don about it over the phone in the very near future as well.

 

The angle of attack on the fore & aft wings if set at a positive angle of incidence can cause the boat to go airborn at an early speed, this is probably why yours is seeing the air at around 30 mph, mine started doing it at around 45-50 mph.

 

Lets say you set the fore wing at a minus 1 to 1 1/2 degree of incidence and the rear wing at 0 degrees, in my way of thinking (thios could be dangerous.. :unsure: ) this should tame the hull considerably...True of False?

 

Chuck did you assemble the hull pieces together or did Dick assemble them for you?

 

Joe Wiebelhaus, question to you is how much do you think needs to be added to the rear shoes on the Bud T-4? I always thought that they were out of the water when most of the boats that have them were on full plane, both full size & model......