Pay N Pak

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Looks good Grim. Only problem I have with it is there isn't a roostertail behind it and the lettering APPEARS to be yellow and brown, like in the later 1978 Madison paint scheme
No problem..

The Scale Twenty Society rules stated that if modeled after a full scale boat to make attempt to paint it in the sprit of the real boat. you know me.. the boat was natural wood, yellow and black.

Tony from Chicago owns the boat now and I do indeed miss it. It was a great running boat. I should have never sold it.

Best I could tell the boat was 1/11 scale. The driver was some football player dude I found at toys R us. The boat had a full driver legs and all.

The stock cowl was a Challenge to build.. I dont like filler so the joints had to be perfect.

Clear was PPG 2042 and I had the local auto detail shop make the decals.

Good fun

Grim
 
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Awesome. I cant say this one wont be like that. :D
It won't be like that for two simple reasons:

1) You have been given lots of info on how to make the boat work and what not to do

2) You have all of us to ask questions along the way if you have a problem or you're not sure about something

Nuff said about building heavy boat anchors :)
Awesome you guys rock. Boat guys are the best in the RC field hands down! :D
 
Looks good Grim. Only problem I have with it is there isn't a roostertail behind it and the lettering APPEARS to be yellow and brown, like in the later 1978 Madison paint scheme
No problem..

The “Scale Twenty Society” rules stated that if modeled after a full scale boat to make attempt to paint it in the sprit of the real boat. you know me.. the boat was natural wood, yellow and black.

Tony from Chicago owns the boat now and I do indeed miss it. It was a great running boat. I sold have never sold it.

Best I could tell the boat was 1/11 scale. The driver was some football player dude I found at toys R us. The boat had a full driver legs and all.

The stock cowl was a “Challenge” to build.. I don’t like filler so the joints had to be perfect.

Clear was PPG 2042 and I had the local auto detail shop make the decals.

Good fun

Grim
Grim,

That boat looks great!
 
Leave it to Grim to do things the hard way. I just went back and looked at that picture again, I can see a little grain on the side of the cowl. And to think, I thought it was just a cloudy day when the picture was taken
 
Oops,should have asked this earlier, Griz, when do we get to see pictures with saw dust? All this talking about the boat has me wondering if I should build one just to see what will happen with all my "changes" thrown in :unsure:
 
Here is a video of the 1980 turbine pak blowing over.


I love the Jones designed Pay N pak hull. Heres a pic of where its at today.

These are the only pics I can find or have on the Pak...If you guys have more pics lets take a peek...
 
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You can look at http://www.missmadison.com and go into the picture section. There is at least one in the classics area
This is a cool pic...For those out there if your curious, this was the Pak hull. This same hull was also Muncey's U-76 Atlas Van Lines...Which I dont have pics of..

Thx HJ for the website!
The shot on the left was from the last few years the boat raced. The one on the right is from 1978, with a paint scheme applied by the Atlas team prior to the boat being handed over to the Miss Madison team
 
Oops,should have asked this earlier, Griz, when do we get to see pictures with saw dust? All this talking about the boat has me wondering if I should build one just to see what will happen with all my "changes" thrown in :unsure:
I'm going to start the build pretty soon I've got to finish a project I've got but then it's time for the PNP! If you do one with all the mods I would Like to see it.
 
Thanks for what Glenn? All I said was that I would probably tweek the sponson runners if I was to build one.

Is your boat tail heavy? If there is too much weight in the back end, it could cause the sponsons to fly rather than skim the surface. IF built stock, with the short forward bottom section, it could cause the same thing at higher speeds, as per Grim's earlier post

Not tail heavy-balances 1/2" behind sponsom transom. Had a friend take a few pics of the boat running and it looked a bit nose up tail down so I decided to make a few changes for next season- strut deeper, 1400 series prop to replace X series-hope to keep the boat a bit more level and trap less air.

Glenn
 
Okay Glenn, I understand now. Let us know how it works with the 14 series prop.

Griz, I may just have to do a build to find out myself. If all goes well, I should have my 36" Pak done within a few weeks. That may not include paint, but oh well. I'd like to take it down to the Roger Newton Memorial R/C Hydroplane Exibit next month and having it ready to run, even if not painted would be nice. I'd like to have my Muck somewhat ready to take down as well. We'll see :rolleyes:
 
we had great luck with a 1740 prop on out PNPs.. I know odd.. the 1.6 was also good on the boat.

Grim
 
So you're saying the 14 series would be underpropping the boat then? Is this with the reworked bottom or with it in stock configuration? If I remember right, the plastic prop that came with the hardware kit was no more than a maybe a 300 or 400 equivalent. Hard to believe that they included a prop with that little pitch from the factory as compared to what you found to work the best. I guess times have changed :)
 
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Nope.. i did not say that...

1440 cupped was good to... 1640 works too..

Grim
Okay, I just wanted to be sure I was understanding correctly. So a 1440, 1540 1640 and 1740 are all good baseline props for the 30" Pak hull, good to know if I build one :)

Now I just need to get the kit and start tracing onto some 1/16th ply and then make some sawdust :D
 
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Rather than make my last post massive, I decided to make option 3 as it's own post. This one is a partial redesign as well, so it will take some work. If this seems like too much to handle, don't attempt it. With that being said, here we go.

Step 1. Trace around ALL the framing parts using 1/16th ply instead of 1/8 except the sponson sheers, they need to be 1/8. Be sure to lengthen the tabs like in option 2. One change you can make is to widen the engine bay to 4" if it's not that wide from the factory. I can explain that proceedure if needed later. Mark but do not cut any of the interlocking slots on any parts for now. Cut out all the parts and set asside all but the furthest forward frame, radio box front, transom and one sponson inside

Step 2. Cut the slots for the furthest forward frame and the front of the radio box in the sponson inside and the interlocking slot in this part of the frame only. Be sure the slots are big enough for the frames to fit without being tight. Excess space isn't good.

Step 3. Slip the two frames and transom into the slots cut in the sponson inside and, using a straigh edge, draw a line from the bottom of the transom to the radio box front and then to the front frame. This gives you the modified bottom profile. Glue a 1/8" piece of square spruce along the top of this line. Now repeat the process on the other sponson inside, making sure there is a left and a right

Step 4. Cut out the remaining slots, again making sure they are not sloppy or tight in fit. You will need to modify the frame between the front frame and radio box front as the bottom will be higher in this area than in the stock kit. You will also need to notch the frames to clear the previously installed glue blocks. Dry assemble the framework and mark the engine bay walls so they match the new bottom profile, remove the excess and install glue blocks along the bottom edge again making sure there is a left and a right. Reinstall the engine bay walls with the glue blocks facing the sponson insides

Step 5. Install the bottom as described in the kit instructions. You may need to use new material if the boat was widened or the supplied parts no longer will work.

Step 6. Cut lightening holes out of all the underdeck framing. This will lighten up the hull and make draining any water that may get in possible. When you're finished, the boat will look like this, except without the sides and sponsons skinned. In the case of my boat, I made several changes, such as moving the fuel tank under the deck with a bottom access hatch and running the cooling lines under the deck, but all that will come later. If this looks like something you want to try I can go further later
I would like more info on this build it sounds like I can get the performance I'm looking for this way.
 
Okay Glenn, I understand now. Let us know how it works with the 14 series prop.

Griz, I may just have to do a build to find out myself. If all goes well, I should have my 36" Pak done within a few weeks. That may not include paint, but oh well. I'd like to take it down to the Roger Newton Memorial R/C Hydroplane Exibit next month and having it ready to run, even if not painted would be nice. I'd like to have my Muck somewhat ready to take down as well. We'll see :rolleyes:
Sounds good
 
Okay, we can do this, so I'll take it one step at a time. I won't give you everything in one post as I don't want to overwelm you :eek: If you want to widen the boat, you will need to make the changes in step 1 and 2 by adding the desired amount of increase to the cross frames in the engine bay. This is done by tracing around the parts on one end to around the middle of the engine bay and then slide the part the desired distance away from the end already traced. You then finish tracing around the second end of the part and your boat will be wider. THIS MUST BE DONE TO ALL CROSS FRAMES, INCLUDING THE TRANSOMS AND CARE MUST BE TAKEN TO KEEP THE PARTS STRAIGHT, ESPECIALLY ACROSS THE BOTTOM OF THE FRAMES

1) Trace around all of the framing onto 1/16th aircraft ply except frame 4, the sponson sheers and the transom. Frame 4 and the sheers will get 1/8th aircraft ply and the transom will be talked about in step 2. Do not cut out the slots at this time, just mark them for reference

2) Trace around the inside half of the transom on 3/16ths or 1/4 aircraft ply so you get all of the slot locations. When you cut the transom out, leave some extra at both ends and across the top to make glueing the deck and aft nontrips easier. More on this later.

3) Cut out the slots for frames 1 and 6 in the sponson insides. I normally cut the slots to the back half of the factory slots, especially the in the case of frame 4. With frame 1, you need to cut the slot to the front side of the factory slot to keep the engine bay walls fitting properly

Cut the slots for the sponson insides in frames 1 and 6. Be sure to cut them so that the slot outside edge is in a straight line to the bottom of the sponson on frame 1 and the nontrip mounting on frame 6. Slip the two frames into the slots in the sponson inside and, with a straight edge, draw a line between the bottom of frame 1 and 6. This will be your new bottom profile as shown in the picture of Grim's boat

4) Repeat step 3 for the other side of the boat and I will give you more info when you're ready. I figure this will take a day or two for you to finish to this point :)
 
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