Odonell, Blue Thunder, or Cool Power?

[strykerpilot66]

These are the 3 available fuel brands at my LHS...any thoughts on which one may be the obvious best? I know about Redmax, but I'd rather support the local guy than order over the net. The main concern I have is that all of these are car/truck fuels, not boat.

TIA

 

[nitrotoys]

Out of the 3, I would say Odonnel.

I have ran the 10% in my boat, and I liked it alot.

The only draw back is the fuel is clear.

LOL Hard to see in tank.

Ran good in my CMB. and it was the car fuel, It was enough oil to run a boat.

I have run the other and dont care for them.

 

[Jay_Stone]

You don't want to use CAR Fuel in boats. Most car fuel has only 10-12% Oil Content.

I run Sidewinder fuel in my cars, 30% Nitro and 12% Castor Oil.

I would ask you local hobby shop to order you some Odonnel or Sidewinder (which is made by Morgan - same company that makes Coolpower) in a boat mixture. I would suggest 40% nitro and 18% Oil.

The correct oil content is more critical than the brand of the fuel.

 

[nitrotoys]

I think the odonnel has like 16% in it,

and DONT GO TO 40% LMAO We have worked so hard to get him on track here. Some guest comes in and says 40% > > > >

 

[[email protected]]

Out of the three you've asked about I'd get the O'Donnell's if you want to support the LHS. I've used it with good satisfaction and haven't broken anything. It tends to leave the bpat, motor and pipe very messy though.

Nitrotoys is right, there's enough oil in it now. I hate it being so clear, do you think the Blue easter egg dye I add to it will effect my performance? LOL

 

[Jay Stone]

Nitrotoys:

You are right. AS a guest I obviously don't know squat.

You are definitley pointing the guy in the right direction telling him to use CAR FUEL in a boat engine. HAHA Why dont you call Sandy or Bobby at Tidewater and ask them what percentage nitro and oil content you should run in that CMB of yours.

New boaters getting told something totally wrong. If I recall, this gentleman "STRYKERPILOT" has been on other message boards and talked about having a new CMB 90 engine. He should run 35-40% nitro with at least 18% oil. That would be my suggestion.

This is an open forum last time I checked? I have every right to answer his question. If you don't like my response.... I could care less.

 

[Grimracer]

Mr. Stone

You are a welcome here as much as the next guy and im glad to see that you have become a member. Your input and expertise is most welcome. I had the chance to race with you at the 2002 Impba internats and I remember your good nature and fun to be hanging with the racers attitude.

Welcome aboard.

To get to the post:

To be honest if you are not using a boat fuel (i.e. correct nitro and oil content) you are only hurting yourself. To little oil and it will not be long and it will be time for a new motor. To much oil and your motor will not give you good performance..

Jays recommendation is right on the money and should be considered good to go.

Rock on ;D

Grimracer

 

[nitrotoys]

So back to the question, You can eather run what your LHS has, or order boat blend fuel.

Or could put a couple ounces of Klotz oil in your fuel, that will raise the % also.

Or like many of us have done, Run it the way it is.

Course high nitro i guess is recommened.

and for a play boat, for people that dont know this is his PLAY boat, and first boat, so a few on here recommended him to use a lower % nitro for Tuning reasons. But do what you will, and run what you want to run.

guess iv been wrong all this time.

 

[Jay Stone]

Mike,

Thanks! I enjoyed racing with you at the Internats. It was a fun week. Thanks also for your support of the 2003 NAMBA Nats that I recently CD'ed.. You should see a race program in the mail any day now.

When will you have some Ninja's available? I'd like to get one.

I re-read my response and realized I sounded like an ass responding to Nitrotoys. I appologize for that.

Correct oil content is crucial no matter what nitro percentage someone runs. To hear someone being told that CAR Fuel is okay to run reminds me of some of the local hobby shop horror stories. Most local hobby shops don't run boats or even stock many parts. Their knowledge for the most part (NOT ALL HOBBY SHOPS MIND YOU, BUT THE MAJORITY) of nitro powered boats is non-existent. I always support my LHS and appreciate having one nearby.

I run 60% and 70% fuel.. I wouldn't suggest that percentage of nitro to some sport boater or new boater. I also personally run 20% oil in my fuel. There is some performance increase when you drop down to 14 or 16% oil, but the side effects of that can be costly. Good rule of thumb is always 18% oil.

 

[Slideblues]

The cool thing about a open forum is a free exchange of different ideas, Then you pull what you can use and go on the next topic.

Some times we also have to agree to disagree, thats just people.

Thing is we all care about the hobby and want to help in any way we can

Gene ;D

 

[Joe Knesek]

A high percentage of oil will do nothing to protect the motor if you continuously lean the motor enough to burn the plug. A rich mixture with 14% oil still supplies more oil to the motor than a lean mixture of 20%.

If you're constantly burning plugs, the motor is not happy and no fuel in the world will save the motor. On the other hand, I've been running 14% oil for at least 10 years and have not had any engine failures related to fuel.

Don't get me wrong, I would not recommend this as a practice for a new boater. I'm just saying the oil is relative to the mixture.

 

[Tunnelbill]

Hi Jay,

You are a Newbie ;D, Great to see you on the board.

About the question, to me boat fuel is for boats and car fuel is for cars. I found out the hard way, I was playing around with one of my cars and I wanted it to go faster so I filled it up with 60% Redmax. Well it was fast as Hell for about 45 seconds and that was that, it sets on my bench for me to look at and remind me to never do that again!!! I run High Nitro because I race, but high nitro is not for everyone.

Just my 2 cents, TB

 

[TimD]

I think Jay touched on part of the subject that is very important.

What does the engine importer or manufacturer recommend?

There is another factor to consider when talking about oil % and that is how much is castor oil and how much is Synthetic and what type is it.

Castor behaves very differently to synthetic oil in relation to heat and it's ability to draw it out of an engine. Sure it's messy but it works.

There is a cerain brand of Synthetic oil that I wouldn't use even if it was free. Pistons, liners and bearings cost too much money.

 

[Joe Knesek]

Tim, the trouble is that the only engine makers that spend any time racing boats are CMB and MAC. They base these recommendations from, you guessed it, cars.

If you go to the CMD web site, you will see that they recommend 60% for a 21 MAC. Most fuel blenders will tell you that Caster does not stay blended with high nitro ratios. If you fail to use it quickly, it goes bad.

Exposing the fuel to sun light also has ill effects on fuel. This is why O'Donnell fuel is in a white jug.

 

[TimD]

Unfortunately the marine engine market is very small in comparison to the car market and so the comment about tests in cars is right in a lot of cases. Some manufacturers test their smaller engines on a bench with an air prop and a tacho.

However I know that other manufacturers and/or distributors do have fuel reccomendations based on failures and returns (warranties etc).

Kalistratov engines have a tendency to nip the chrome to the piston if you don't run any castor - and Al Hobbs advises people who buy these engines that you should run some castor and a minimum total oil content. This is based on running in boats.

Castor does not mix with very high nitro % - say over 50% but it is just a matter of shaking the fuel jug before fueling up the boat - no big deal. it takes a while to separate again.

Anyone ever wonder why the boats run cleaner on synthetic oils? where does it go? up in smoke!

If you want to see how good castor is at it's job, try heating a small spot on some level steel plate with a torch. then put a drop of castor oil next to the heated spot - the castor should be attracted to the heat spot! guess what a lot of synthetic oils do...

Something that affects very high % nitro is that it usually has propylene oxide in it to help burn the nitro - that stuff goes bad or evaporates out very quickly. The other problem with fuel is that methanol attracts moisture from the air.

My current fuel mix is 50% nitro, 15% klotz, 5% castor - no separating problems and good shelf life due to no propylene oxide in it. No melted pistons either after lean runs and good piston / liner life. I could probably gain a small amount of performance by reducing the oil and increasing the nitro - but is it worth it? Is it going to let me swing a bigger prop and / or more rev's? maybe, but I don't have to rebuild or replace engines anywhere near as often and I have less DNF's...

 

[Ian Inverarity]

I would tend to agree with Jay's recommendation. Often an engine that is set up for high nitro (and that CMB probably is) run poorly on lower nitro because the compression is too low and the heat generated in combustion isn't quite enough to keep the plug lit at partial throttle.

I also agree with Tim's suggestion about castor in the fuel, I use 7% castor and 13% Klotz.

As to what is available in hobby shops I really dont know. Maybe it would be better to buy the components (nitro, methanol, oil) and mix yourself. At least you know what you are getting.

Ian.

 

[EatMyShortsRacing]

Dont know if anyone else has had this experience but when we tried cool power oil we seemed to have a lot more engine failures. This may be a coincidence so if anyone else has experience racing with cool power that may help determine whether that oil is ok to use.

Personally I use 15% oil 50/50 castor and NEO (probably lb625 - fuel goes black in sunlight).

EMS Racing is there room in my fuel for methanol???

 

[TimD]

Dont know if anyone else has had this experience but when we tried cool power oil we seemed to have a lot more engine failures.

YEP.

 

[Propjockey]

Hmmmmm......I ran Cool Power in my planes for years without problems...I wonder if the boat stuff is that much different. ???

 

[ClayGlover]

is this the culprit? ???

cool power 2-stroke oil