IMPBA Sport 20/40 2012 Rule Proposal, Author Needs Input Please

[Mark Leyde]

Tom, The rule in IMPBA is that the sport 20 and 40 hulls must represent a LIMITED or UNLIMITED hydroplane of PAST or PRESENT. Not just unlimited's of the past.

Mark

 

[Don Ferrette]

The rule is written as stated in previous posts. Similar to an UNLIMITED HYDRO. That means strut under. Sebastien,you said you and your fellow Canadians build them that way to be a faster boat. THE RULES SHOULD BE FOLLOWED,UNTIL OR IF THEY ARE CHANGED. Don't build or try to use an illegal boat as long as the rule reads the way it reads.Sorry you did not make Elmira,we all missed you. The other sport classes came well after Sport 40 and rules were written for them but our fore fathers did not see a need for a change to a GREAT class. Don't let the few ruin it for the rest of us that love our Sport 40's the way they are. PT has been building a great boat for a long,long time and I don't see him changing them. He knows the rules and am very greatful for his knowledge and legal boats AND LEGAL INSTRUCTIONS. Don Ferette, why would you allow illegal boats to run in a great class. The WHY you keep asking about is about current rules. Builds after the FACT are trying to get rules changed. It just is not right and keep the rules on SPORT 40 ALONE. Tom Galdys

Since you called me out how about you or anyone else explain exactly HOW allowing the boater the choice of under or on the transom will "ruin" the class?? That is the biggest bunch of hooey I've heard in a long time. This thread has gone on for seven pages now and not one single person has been able to say WHY the choice shouldn't offered like the seven other IMPBA sport hydro classes allow. If you "love" you sport 40 like it is that's fine and good for you, even Phil Thomas said it doesn't matter since you brought his boat into it. And saying because that's the way it's been or it was the first sport rules written is nothing more than a big time cop out. Since you want to point out the rules read this part of the sport 40 rules EXACTLY as it appears in the IMPBA rulebook-

2. Hull must be a three (3)-point hydroplane configuration and resemble a limited or

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unlimited hydroplane design of past or present, except outrigger, modified outrigger,

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tunnel, or canard hulls are NOT permitted.

Many if not most of the real limiteds now run transom mounted struts so here's the bottom line to the few of you posting against it - please justify your position as to why not with something substantial. What are you guys afraid of? Do you think a transom mounted strut gives some magical super advantage? So let's hear the REAL reason some of you are so against this one simple change to bring consistency as far as strut placement to all the IMPBA sport classes.

 

[P THOMAS]

Sorry everyone for the delay, I didnt even see anyone actually showing interest in this post. I asked the builders/designers for input got a little in the beginning... but never got much feedback after that point. I have been asked to see what i have and will hopefully be getting some direction.... I am trying to please everyone and not pleasing anyone and got lotsa **** going on in my real life at the moment. I have seen posts regarding exhaust.... that will not be part of this proposal ( to many boats that are running now would have to be changed). Strut, not sure if that will be added to this rule or be proposed on it own. If this rule doesnt pass then the strut rule wont .... the strut rule change on its own would probably have a good chance of passing.

Again the Whole point of this proposal was to try and keep the look and feel of the class...

Paul

Hi Paul, If you want to send out the proposal for the strut as it is written in the sport20 rules that would be someting to vote on.

If we had the strut rule change along with the 3 point hydro config and resemble a limited hydro rule as it is now that would cover the 40 boats that are up in dist 1 and they could bring them to more races..

2. Hull must be a three (3)-point hydroplane configuration and resemble a limited or

unlimited hydroplane design of past or present, except outrigger, modified outrigger,

tunnel, or canard hulls are NOT permitted

The rest of the revision could be voted on separtly or as a whole.

I will work with you at Hobart, bring what you have now.

 

[tom galdys]

Ok, My last word on the subject and if anything else need be said it will be on the IMPBA site. The rule does state there is no transom mounted struts if #7 of the rules means anything. To further the class and bring in the transom mounted boats is ok.Not sure about the performance difference. As it stands right now,they are illegal in IMPBA races UNLESS the race flyer says different. It should be decided by the IMPBA and tried as a test and then voted upon.I was only speaking on changes to any boats made, not sanctioned by the IMPBA that don't meet the specs. Don, you left out under rules, #7 NO PART OF STRUT MAY PROTRUDE BEHIND THE TRANSOM OF THE BOAT. . So you are OUT my boating friend Tom Galdys

 

[Grimracer]

Tom, The rule in IMPBA is that the sport 20 and 40 hulls must represent a LIMITED or UNLIMITED hydroplane of PAST or PRESENT. Not just unlimited's of the past.

Mark

If this is true we have done a horrible job of doing this.. My last sport 20 looks like a potato chip with sponsons.. Met the rules but still looks like a potato chip..



Grim

 

[Don Ferrette]

I know #7 was there, I posted all of #2 not just a piece of it.

"To further the class and bring in the transom mounted boats is ok"

Tom that's all I ever wanted to do from the beginning, just make the strut rule consistent for all our sport hydro boats.

 

[Mark Leyde]

Tom, The rule in IMPBA is that the sport 20 and 40 hulls must represent a LIMITED or UNLIMITED hydroplane of PAST or PRESENT. Not just unlimited's of the past.

Mark

If this is true we have done a horrible job of doing this.. My last sport 20 looks like a potato chip with sponsons.. Met the rules but still looks like a potato chip..

Grim

What do you mean if this is true Grim? It's in the rule book. And if I am not mistaken.You were one of the guy's that wrote the sport 20 class rules.

Mark

 

[Don Ferrette]

My last sport 20 looks like a potato chip with sponsons.. Met the rules but still looks like a potato chip..

Did you do it up in a Pringle's paint scheme? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Sorry Z I just couldn't resist.

 

[Grimracer]

Yes.. but I did not write the intent!...



And your right.. when sport 20 "first" started in the north (we had no idea the south was doing it too) it was called "Scale 20".... BUT.. you can thank your current IMPBA "rule set" for ruing that!



Scale Twenty as we called it was drafted by Myself and Bill Colman (Don’t think you have been at this long enough to know him.. he is unforgettable!)



Ever see Zaker Jrs "Scale 20"? He still has it and its DAM FAST! but.......... the class turned into potato chips...



I am ALL FOR racing potato chips if its potato chips we are to be racing!... But just what are we racing? The intent says one thing and the rest of the rules another.. that IS.. the issue!



We either need to clarify the issues based on the intent.. Or drop the intent and better define what’s there.

Just my nickle 95...



Grim

 

[Grimracer]

My last sport 20 looks like a potato chip with sponsons.. Met the rules but still looks like a potato chip..

Did you do it up in a Pringle's paint scheme? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Sorry Z I just couldn't resist.

Why yes.. I did.. I KID!

Grim

 

[Ray Sametz]

Just a question???? If I put an extended strut on the transom, in theory I make the boat 3 inches longer. Don't you think that's an advantage??? With all the rocket scientist out there, you better make this new rule with no loop holes. ^_^

 

[Mark Leyde]

Ray, it does not make the hull any longer. But small adjustment to your strut will make a huge difference in how the boat handles. Because there is a bigger machanical advantage or maybe in this case it would really be a disadvantage. Depends on what your hull needs.

 

[Grimracer]

Just a question???? If I put an extended strut on the transom, in theory I make the boat 3 inches longer. Don't you think that's an advantage??? With all the rocket scientist out there, you better make this new rule with no loop holes. ^_^

When it comes to "race water" longer is better!.. Bottom line.. IF it was not ture the "real" boats would have struts under the boats.. like they use too...

Grim

 

[SeanKewley]

Strut, not sure if that will be added to this rule or be proposed on it own. If this rule doesnt pass then the strut rule wont .... the strut rule change on its own would probably have a good chance of passing.

Paul

I agree Paul. Don't try to pack too much in your rule proposal. Just address the hull stuff for now and leave the strut issue for a separate proposal. For those of you interested in proposing transom mounted struts in sport 40 write something up and submit it to your district director.

 

[Samuel Hagan JR]

This is suppose to be a fun hobby. I understand that some guys put a lot of time and money into there boats. But guys come on. Is it really that big of a deal.

 

[Slideblues]

Back a few years the last APBA meeting I attended, After the minutes were read and current business took maybe 15 minutes,

The other 45 + was the sport / scale guys fussing bout air traps, colors, wings, length..........

So yea seems to be a ongoing thing :lol:

Gene

 

[Mark Leyde]

Just a question???? If I put an extended strut on the transom, in theory I make the boat 3 inches longer. Don't you think that's an advantage??? With all the rocket scientist out there, you better make this new rule with no loop holes. ^_^

When it comes to "race water" longer is better!.. Bottom line.. IF it was not ture the "real" boats would have struts under the boats.. like they use too...

Grim

Wrong Grim. The style of strut real boats use under the hull weigh like a ton more than the ones that hang on the back of the transom. Do you want prof I have pictures. From the limited hulls that were in my dad shop from time to time.

 

[Grimracer]

The Superior Miss 2.5L hydro..

I really don’t give a hoot about strut placement. lol. When and if it comes to the body I will vote. I hope you do too! that’s more important the shoving opinions on the rest of everybody..

Back to Paul’s needs..

That’s it for me.. let the proposals fly!

Grim

 

[gooycheese]

I am Truly Sorry to the membership of the IMPBA. I have Moved I am using my wifes laptop now or my cellphone for all online correspondence. I dont have any of my sport rule proposal files on this computer. I have noticed things have been happening recently that "Would NOT" Pass the rules I am trying to propose. I personally dont think they pass the current rules. In the current rules for both sport 20 & 40 line number 2 reads:

2. Hull must be a three (3)-point hydroplane configuration and resemble a limited or

unlimited hydroplane design of past or present, except outrigger, modified outrigger,

tunnel, or canard hulls are NOT permitted.

Has there been changes made to the limited or unlimited hydroplane design of past or present?

I will trying dealing with my personal issues and try and get my proposal ready..... I know this wont please everyone... and this proposal wont pass if people dont vote.

Paul

 

[Bruce Jacobs]

I guess I have to ask why someone who dosen't even run a sport 40 or 20 is submitting a rule change to the board. To keep it simple, lets appoint one person from IMPBA and NAMBA to review the current rules and come up with a simple set of rules to allow both our groups to run a boat at either venue. It can't be that hard to do. The whole purpose of our groups is to foster model boating, not drive some away with stupid rules. One being the added one that states you cannot run twin motors, what purpose does this serve, as it's a displacement based motor class so that should be it. We need to let the guy that sits out in the shop late at nite and comes up with something weird see what it does. If we are to emulate the full size boats, then why disallow the tunnel, carnard or rigger design, Scale allows it and none of those designs are running away with the trophies. The whole rule book is riddled with petty add-ons to prevent this or that guy from running his design. The board as awhole needs to review these changes and throw most of them out. This hobby is suppose to be fun so lets start working on that. My 2 cents worth. bj