IMPBA Internats Update

[waltr]

I'm sorry, but just one little post, for one day was pretty weak if you ask me.

I've seen more hype for a fun run than was posted for the Internats. <_<

 

[HTV Boats]

I guess finger pointing does indentify symptoms but there seems to be some ongoing issues with the "Internats". The Springnats and Charlestons Fallnats seem to be doing well and the Winternats which is now under Namba juristiction turns people away. The "Tunnel Champs" even in a down economy is thriving. Hmmm 3&4 day long weekend specialty events?

Years ago the two things that kept me from the Internats were "1-2weeks off work & driving distance" Rotating locations helps but can change competition level when the site is too far one way. I have attended the last two Internats and had planned to go to NY. Spoke with Pete last week and for my own logistics hadn't sent my families entry in. The deadline still is two weeks out and the race is toast. My family brings 3 racers and 10-12 entries. I also travel about as far as anyone comming from very south Florida.

Had the deadline been June 10th maybe we all would have been registered sooner? Too late now for this event. Hard to keep a sinking ship afloat when the crew is not there anymore. No blame as they must have their reasons Wilth no bids from multiple clubs the event has to expect these posibilities.

Moving forward I hope this doesn't happen again. I would also hate to loose the time trial format. US-1 is a big deal but maybe needs a tune up with the times and ammount of boats. Last year there weren't enough entries for one class to justify US-1 and we have guys in B sport Tunnel showing up in force and no US-1 for them? Gas and FE are growing too. . Hard to satisfy everyone. Lets all take time to discuss what might work better and only blame ourselves as a group.

Just my 2cents

Mic Halbrehder

 

[Mark Bullard]

In years passed we had trouble getting clubs to put on the Internats. These past two years we have had trouble with racers going to the Internats. The host clubs have even had problems with getting sponsors for the race. In the older format you did not need sponsors but the new format makes it a have to case. This is ok but the things that happened in 2006 has caused the sponsors to quit helping out and the older diehard racers have to quit going to the Internats and they are the ones that bring all the boats. The Atlanta, Evansville , and Charleston races have no problem having over 200 to 300 boats for a weekend race. And this is where you will see all of the diehard racers. Out of the 20 diehard boat racers that went to the internats they would bring 200 boats. So I ask the question why do you think this happened and is the board going to step up and put on the Internats.

 

[Topfuel666]

I was asked by our club members to clarify some salient points raised in the many other posts on this. This is not intended to offend anyone but merely state the facts.

1. Aside from the IMPBA providing the US1 trophy plaques, the club receives no funding from the IMPBA.

2. We have (had) one sponsor committed and that was Glenn Quarles of NovaRossi Of America. We initiated the sponsor drive last year. Sponsor packet mailings were sent the first week of December 2008 to roughly 100 individuals. Bottom line: there are no sponsors, raffle prizes or giveaways.

3. Several posts have been active on I/W asking who is attending. Virtually no response. Interpretation by me: no one is planning to attend. My email and phone as well Pete Forcier's was available to all in the event folks had questions. No contact or queries. We are totally reliant on registrations at this point to fund the event.

The decision to cancel was thought out and done under a sad note. The principal reason: the distinct high risk of the club going bankrupt.

Bill Kozuck

 

[Greg Hahn]

Teddy,
Please don't take offense to this o.k.

But have you ever one a us-1?

I have 3 of them and i can tell you that it is with out a doubt one of if not the hardest things in model boating to do.

I agree there needs to be changes. . it is a shame that this all has or had to transpire this way.. I guess if the club feels it can't do it.. then so be it.

but this part of the situation is not the impba's fault. the impba didn't make cause them to cancel or possibly cancel the race. the host club chose that.

i do agree maybe it is time we rethink things a bit.. and get the event back to what it used to be

THE PREMIER EVENT in impba.

again.. not trying to stir the pot or fight.. just speaking my 2 cents

Just a short note on this part of the discussion. These are the very reasons the AMA Nats is now being held in the same place every year and Managed by the AMA (centrally located). Might be something to think about for the future of IMPBA. I'm not at all trying to compare the two organizations, I know there are many differences.

When the decision was made to hold it in Muncie every year there were a lot of unhappy folks over it but logisticly and for management it has worked out for the best.

The Special Intrest Groups and Clubs still have a hand in the contest but the overall management is done by the AMA, it's staff and it's volunteers.

The Internats should be an IMPBA thing not a club thing. Very few of the clubs are either large enough or powerfull enough to manage an event that size JMHO

gh

 

[Darin Jordan]

Only 100 entries? Anyone ever go to what is considered a National event FE boat race? We have more entries at a district nitro and/or gas race!

Kind of a lame low blow...

 

[photohoward1]

In my perfect world everyone would stop bitching about things they don't understand nor can they influence or control.

I also stand by Elmira. This is one wasted year for all boaters.

They have to be run like business. Profitable and respectable business that is.

 

[Roxyflash]

Sad deal.I wasnt going as i dont race anymore.Cant afford the money it takes to go unless its in my back yard.Theres not many races close.The location does make a differance.Another sad thing is no sponsors i understand?I dont think the gas side has that problem.Maybe its time to combine the two.Take some stream lining but probably have more than enough to justify the race.Just a thought.I know what it takes to do a race this size planing it starts the year before when the club decides to hold it.Its a big comitment that needs to follow tru.Im sure the club knows as they had to get time off to hold it.I feal for the people that entered and now having to rethink what they have to do now.Very fustrating!

 

[Marty Davis]

This discussion is interesting, but not really very helpful.

If you will look at the race that was proposed in Hobart, Indiana by 2 people, you will see what promotion can do.

If you will look at the Atlanta Spring Nats, you will see what promotion can do.

If you look at the Orlando Winternats, you will see what promotion can do.

I attended the Internats the last time it was in Elmira and they had trouble running the race. Dick Tindall spoke about that recently. He was heavily involved in turning it around and making it a success. Look at some of the successful clubs who have hosted the Nats successfully. Evansville, Huntsville, etc.

In order to host an Internats you have to start a year out and promote, promote, promote. I just can't see that this was done in this case. I was never contacted about donating for the Internats and I suspect that others might be in the same position.

It is a privilege to host the IMPBA Internats. I have been CD of 2 of them and know first hand the effort that it takes to make it a huge success. I just can't see where that amount of effort was put to this years Internets. Maybe it was but the promotion was not evident here on IW.

I hope that IMPBA finds a great club to host the 2010 NAts and the effort is spent to make it the premier event that it has been in the past.

One other point: Chris Wood indicated that the winning of a US#1 is tough. That is an understatement. I have heard comments from people over the years to make it just a heat race. Many times that comes from people who have never sought or never will win a US#1. It is very easy to just change something so that everyone has a chance to win, but I personally want to see the Nats be the premier tough as heck to win event. The crowning of a winner of US#1 is special and one that is WELL DESERVED. Please don't change it to just another heat race, it is too important.

 

[SayMikey]

This discussion is interesting, but not really very helpful.
If you will look at the race that was proposed in Hobart, Indiana by 2 people, you will see what promotion can do.

If you will look at the Atlanta Spring Nats, you will see what promotion can do.

If you look at the Orlando Winternats, you will see what promotion can do.

I attended the Internats the last time it was in Elmira and they had trouble running the race. Dick Tindall spoke about that recently. He was heavily involved in turning it around and making it a success. Look at some of the successful clubs who have hosted the Nats successfully. Evansville, Huntsville, etc.

In order to host an Internats you have to start a year out and promote, promote, promote. I just can't see that this was done in this case. I was never contacted about donating for the Internats and I suspect that others might be in the same position.

It is a privilege to host the IMPBA Internats. I have been CD of 2 of them and know first hand the effort that it takes to make it a huge success. I just can't see where that amount of effort was put to this years Internets. Maybe it was but the promotion was not evident here on IW.

I hope that IMPBA finds a great club to host the 2010 NAts and the effort is spent to make it the premier event that it has been in the past.

One other point: Chris Wood indicated that the winning of a US#1 is tough. That is an understatement. I have heard comments from people over the years to make it just a heat race. Many times that comes from people who have never sought or never will win a US#1. It is very easy to just change something so that everyone has a chance to win, but I personally want to see the Nats be the premier tough as heck to win event. The crowning of a winner of US#1 is special and one that is WELL DESERVED. Please don't change it to just another heat race, it is too important.

Well said Marty i agree with every word! need i say more NOPE you put it perfect

 

[Mark Bullard]

This discussion is interesting, but not really very helpful.
If you will look at the race that was proposed in Hobart, Indiana by 2 people, you will see what promotion can do.

If you will look at the Atlanta Spring Nats, you will see what promotion can do.

If you look at the Orlando Winternats, you will see what promotion can do.

I attended the Internats the last time it was in Elmira and they had trouble running the race. Dick Tindall spoke about that recently. He was heavily involved in turning it around and making it a success. Look at some of the successful clubs who have hosted the Nats successfully. Evansville, Huntsville, etc.

In order to host an Internats you have to start a year out and promote, promote, promote. I just can't see that this was done in this case. I was never contacted about donating for the Internats and I suspect that others might be in the same position.

It is a privilege to host the IMPBA Internats. I have been CD of 2 of them and know first hand the effort that it takes to make it a huge success. I just can't see where that amount of effort was put to this years Internets. Maybe it was but the promotion was not evident here on IW.

I hope that IMPBA finds a great club to host the 2010 NAts and the effort is spent to make it the premier event that it has been in the past.

One other point: Chris Wood indicated that the winning of a US#1 is tough. That is an understatement. I have heard comments from people over the years to make it just a heat race. Many times that comes from people who have never sought or never will win a US#1. It is very easy to just change something so that everyone has a chance to win, but I personally want to see the Nats be the premier tough as heck to win event. The crowning of a winner of US#1 is special and one that is WELL DESERVED. Please don't change it to just another heat race, it is too important.

Very well said Marty, To change the Internats to a heat race is to lower the standard for US 1. I myself back into one in 1988 as you remember and Doc just won his first one in 2005 after 25 years of going to the Internats. We both have been very, very close over the years but it will get away from you very fast. In 2005 when Doc won his first one I was very close to winning it. All I had to do was lay down a good pass in straightaway. Boat in the water and running good fixing to call for a pass, open the motors up to clean them out a little and pop goes the seal on a glowplug. Everyone at the lake heard it and watch my US 1 and the John Bridge award go to US 3. But Doc did deserve it and I had help him get there as he had help me get there.

 

[Norm Doerr]

This discussion is interesting, but not really very helpful.
If you will look at the race that was proposed in Hobart, Indiana by 2 people, you will see what promotion can do.

If you will look at the Atlanta Spring Nats, you will see what promotion can do.

If you look at the Orlando Winternats, you will see what promotion can do.

I attended the Internats the last time it was in Elmira and they had trouble running the race. Dick Tindall spoke about that recently. He was heavily involved in turning it around and making it a success. Look at some of the successful clubs who have hosted the Nats successfully. Evansville, Huntsville, etc.

In order to host an Internats you have to start a year out and promote, promote, promote. I just can't see that this was done in this case. I was never contacted about donating for the Internats and I suspect that others might be in the same position.

It is a privilege to host the IMPBA Internats. I have been CD of 2 of them and know first hand the effort that it takes to make it a huge success. I just can't see where that amount of effort was put to this years Internets. Maybe it was but the promotion was not evident here on IW.

I hope that IMPBA finds a great club to host the 2010 NAts and the effort is spent to make it the premier event that it has been in the past.

One other point: Chris Wood indicated that the winning of a US#1 is tough. That is an understatement. I have heard comments from people over the years to make it just a heat race. Many times that comes from people who have never sought or never will win a US#1. It is very easy to just change something so that everyone has a chance to win, but I personally want to see the Nats be the premier tough as heck to win event. The crowning of a winner of US#1 is special and one that is WELL DESERVED. Please don't change it to just another heat race, it is too important.

Exactly!

It takes a lot of dedication, sacrifice (money, time, etc), and enthusiasm to get a US 1 Making it as simple as winning a heat race no longer separates the "dogs on the porch from the dogs in the street". It is a prestigous race for SERIOUS competators. When someone comes home with a US-1 that says something. The luster of the event would be gone if it were reduced to a heat race. Imagine reducing the Triathalon or Decathalon to a simple foot race..........

 

[Don Ferrette]

Let's try to keep things on track, we can talk about US-1 on a new thread if need be. Right now there is a much bigger fish to fry...........

 

[joe d]

I for one dont feel that the internats can be cancelled. so therefore in the past the board hosted the event elsewere. this happened in huntsville back in the 90's, I know becouse I was on the board as dist. 7 director. Ibet if you put it out to the membership the board would get enough help to put on the internats. And yes i would volinteer to help.afterall this is my orginization. lets go board make a dicission.

joe dugas

dist.7

impba 9828

I also hold 5 US-1 and damd proud of them

 

[Ron Olson]

Darin, low blow? No, that's just the way it is. I've been to not only an FE event but also to several scale ship modeler's regatta's also considered national events.

I also feel that a true Internat's should include all classes that are legal in the IMPBA but such an event would take weeks to run.

 

[vanduzer]

Marty and Dick

The nats in 1997 in Elmira went very well with very few problems. Maybe you don't like the desicion about cancelling this years nats and you both have that right. I don't think it is fair to trash our group about 1997 nats. I don't remebers either you not have a good time at the race. Pete Forcier has done alot for R/C in the Northeast for over 25 years. I doubt in that time there are 20 people that have work harder then he has for r/c boats. If you were at the 97 nats In Elmira Nats and had a good time pleae sent Marty and Dick an E-mail. If either you would like to discuss the 1997 nats this off the board please sent me an e-mail [email protected]

Dave Van Duzer

 

[bzubee]

You are spot on Marty of course htere is still the problem of getting clubs to step up to host the event. No good solution has been presented for that problem yet.

This discussion is interesting, but not really very helpful.
If you will look at the race that was proposed in Hobart, Indiana by 2 people, you will see what promotion can do.

If you will look at the Atlanta Spring Nats, you will see what promotion can do.

If you look at the Orlando Winternats, you will see what promotion can do.

I attended the Internats the last time it was in Elmira and they had trouble running the race. Dick Tindall spoke about that recently. He was heavily involved in turning it around and making it a success. Look at some of the successful clubs who have hosted the Nats successfully. Evansville, Huntsville, etc.

In order to host an Internats you have to start a year out and promote, promote, promote. I just can't see that this was done in this case. I was never contacted about donating for the Internats and I suspect that others might be in the same position.

It is a privilege to host the IMPBA Internats. I have been CD of 2 of them and know first hand the effort that it takes to make it a huge success. I just can't see where that amount of effort was put to this years Internets. Maybe it was but the promotion was not evident here on IW.

I hope that IMPBA finds a great club to host the 2010 NAts and the effort is spent to make it the premier event that it has been in the past.

One other point: Chris Wood indicated that the winning of a US#1 is tough. That is an understatement. I have heard comments from people over the years to make it just a heat race. Many times that comes from people who have never sought or never will win a US#1. It is very easy to just change something so that everyone has a chance to win, but I personally want to see the Nats be the premier tough as heck to win event. The crowning of a winner of US#1 is special and one that is WELL DESERVED. Please don't change it to just another heat race, it is too important.

 

[Don Ferrette]

Marty and DickThe nats in 1997 in Elmira went very well with very few problems. Maybe you don't like the desicion about cancelling this years nats and you both have that right. I don't think it is fair to trash our group about 1997 nats. I don't remebers either you not have a good time at the race. Pete Forcier has done alot for R/C in the Northeast for over 25 years. I doubt in that time there are 20 people that have work harder then he has for r/c boats. If you were at the 97 nats In Elmira Nats and had a good time pleae sent Marty and Dick an E-mail. If either you would like to discuss the 1997 nats this off the board please sent me an e-mail [email protected]

Dave Van Duzer

The '97 Nats went well in part because of the help received from people like Dick & John Finch but that was then and this is now so back to the current situation......

I posted the news of what was occurring straight up then sat back and watched. The one thing I keep seeing repeated is trying steer the "blame" onto the membership. Wrong answer, so now it's my turn.......

Marty was the first one to call it like it is. Taking on the Internats is a big time responsibility and requires lots of time, dedication and maximum effort for an extended period. It is not some "cash cow" to be sat on and milked. Compared to other more recent Internats done by other clubs the differences seem apparent, at least to me-

PROMOTION- what promotion? Other than the occasional posts here and there the promo and hype was basically zilch. This should have been on the forefront of topics constantly by various club members, the only person I saw trying was Bill Kozuck and to pin it on one guy is flat out wrong. Look at the successful bigger IMPBA races- Atlanta Spring Nats, Charleston Fall Nats, Hobart (a brand new race) the GasNats, what do they all have in common? BIG TIME hype and promotion from many angles, not like Mr. Schindler said "a tickle a month". This type of event needs to pounded on constantly, nobody contacted myself or the other I/W admins about pinning a nice blurb of the event at the top of the race forum as others have done in the past. Do a search of the aforementioned races and see how many and more importantly how often there are posts. You need to create the buzz, the need, the want to be there. Talk it up and constantly!! Tell about the site, the club, the attractions, the raffle prizes ...... which gets me to number 2......

RAFFLE PRIZES, SPONSORSHIPS AND DONATIONS- first off, who was the individual who saw it fit to send the "packets" out in December? The last thing anyone, myself included, is going to do is look at some mass mailed piece of paper asking for stuff just before Christmas, everyone is wrapped up with dealing with the typically insane demands of that holiday stretch. And even if it wasn't Christmas, sending out a form letter request then waiting to see what comes in ain't gonna cut it, I got one and tossed it aside. Why?? If someone wants something from my little boat biz they're gonna have to contact me directly and talk to me. There are plenty of those who have done just that in the past and I'm sure all can attest to my generosity when I'm able to do so. I've talked to numerous other suppliers who feel exactly the same way. Ya gotta work the sponsors BIG TIME just like the members. A number of years ago when I was still running the D.C. club I pounded on the doors of a few local businesses and got almost all of the classes sponsored for our district race to the point all race expenses, including the trophies, were covered. When that race was over the club was able to go out and purchase a BRAND NEW retrieve boat AND gas outboard motor just from what was made off of a 2 day race! This is how it should be done, not banking on membership head count to get into profitability. The clubs who've hosted the Internats in the past and made a handsome amount of profit for their efforts did just that, ask them & I'm sure they'll share but the common theme is again to WORK it and the membership list of this years (former) host club shows a high body count so the work should have gotten spread around. Work, that reminds me.....

THE "RECRUITING" PHONE CALLS- I'm still trying to figure this one out. Also back in the dead of winter I received a phone call asking if myself and the other 4 or 5 names from my district this person rattled off would come up and work the event. Say what? While this individual will remain nameless I was floored at the request. No personal race invite and "while you're there could you maybe lend a hand", it was a "can you come work" request. I've recently found out I was definitely not alone in receiving that call so what was up with that?? One of the bigger clubs in that district trying to get others hundreds of miles away to come work the event?? There have been plenty of successful Internats done by smaller clubs all on their own so I'm still scratching my head over that one.....

BOTTOM LINE- is this gonna get a few people peaved? I'm sure it will but it's time to call a spade a spade and this trying to lay blame on the membership is a bunch of hooey. I'm convinced if this event had been approached differently, based on proven methods, it would have not been a "money loser" at even 100 boats which seems to be the "reason" to cancel.

That's how I see it like or not.

Flak jacket is now securely fastened in place....................

 

[Terry Keeley]

Was gonna stay out of this but felt I had to "clear the air" for my fellow D1 bro's.

From what I've seen Pete Forcier and the "Southern Tier N/Y R/C Boaters" are a great bunch of guys & gals that are capable of hosting a first class event, I attended the '97 Nats at their old site and except for the usual couple of hickups thought it went well. I also was at their big race in July a couple of years ago and had a great time as they ran 200+ boats for the weekend.

The one and only reason I wasn't going to attend this year is that the site is just too small IMHO for the faster boats. Google Earth doesn't lie, and 600' long squeezing to 200' or so at 4-5-6 is just too tight for me, personally. I'm kinda fussy about my stuff ( :lol: ) and trying to navigate between the shore and a coupla dead boats just isn't my idea of fun. :unsure:

That being said though what other bids were submitted?

It's too bad they decided to quit so far in advance, I'm sure if they waited they'd end up with 2-300 boats, the entries always seem to come last minute.

A very sad time indead for our IMPBA...

 

[El Zorro]

Marty and DickThe nats in 1997 in Elmira went very well with very few problems. Maybe you don't like the desicion about cancelling this years nats and you both have that right. I don't think it is fair to trash our group about 1997 nats. I don't remebers either you not have a good time at the race. Pete Forcier has done alot for R/C in the Northeast for over 25 years. I doubt in that time there are 20 people that have work harder then he has for r/c boats. If you were at the 97 nats In Elmira Nats and had a good time pleae sent Marty and Dick an E-mail. If either you would like to discuss the 1997 nats this off the board please sent me an e-mail [email protected]

Dave Van Duzer

Dave,

The 1997 Internats did go very well and yes I did have a good time there as well. I do not need people sending me emails telling me that they had a good time there, too. I can also agree with you that Pete Forcier has done a lot for model boating in your area for many years. I will NOT, however, go into any of the problems IMPBA had with your club concerning the 1997 Internats because (1) it serves no purpose to discuss or argue such matters on a public forum and (2) if I were to go into the problems we had in 1997 with your club it would only throw your club further "under the bus" than it already is. I will say that if it were not for John Finch, Tracy Dahbura and Patty Zelasko ( I believe she was one of your club members ) to name a few people, you would probably have been in the same hole back then that you are in now.

If you would like me to refresh your memory on the 1997 Internats or if anyone else would like to know what was going on then from the President of IMPBA at that time, please email me at "[email protected]".

Dick Tyndall