NEWS engine " SHOCK"

[Don Ferrette]

.............We've all been running those new CMBs for a while now. Just with blue water jackets.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: LMAO!!!! THAT was funny.

 

[AndyBrown]

Cool.......I see that CMB is now selling tapered headers. Such innovators.

 

[user 115]

Charley,

You know how it goes when everyone is trying to sell the same average product. PRICE WAR!!

I'd agree with you if there was anyone else. Hard to start a price war against yourself!! :lol:

In all seriousness, I wish you the best of luck. I don't make CMB's so don't intend to attack anyone. Hope you guys get some motors out soon.

Charley

 

[P THOMAS]

HA Nice CMB but I bet it will come in a cheap box :lol: :lol:

When will someone get one to TEST

 

[Stuart Barr]

I am sorry to see the new 45 come in this way. The 45 RS is a much better top end motor from what I know at this point.

 

[DaveMarles]

Why are you surprised? Once a thief, always a thief. We knew this was coming .... <_<

Don, That is way way out of order even for you. I have dealt with and raced against the CMB guys for 25 years and they are without doubt some of the most straight up people in this hobby. I don't know what the problem between CMB and Andy was and I'm not interested but I can tell you one thing Don, I am positive you don't know the real story, no matter what you may have been told.

If you are talking about stealing drum valves, tapered headers etc. etc. then give me a break please. Andy didnt invent drum valves, Andy didnt invent tapered headers. Andy is an expert with engines and a top sales promoter and I'm sure his new engines will be the top engines in the USA when they are on sale but, and its a very big but, CMB are the only company that has been making racing marine engines consistently for the last 25 or so years and doing their best to back their product up with spare parts. Others have come and gone, maybe with a better product for a short time, but CMB still continues to be the dominant marine racing engine producer in the world. For sure they are not perfect and they have driven me nuts sometimes but I have also been a distributor for Picco and OPS in the past and I know who I would rather deal with and its not the last two.

For sure CMB has used some of Andys ideas, but so what is new in that? To say that CMB is not an innovator has to be a joke right? CMB made the first solid production .90 with zimmerman disc valve, steel conrod with needle rollers etc way back in 1980 when all we could use before that were OS91 grenades that lasted abut 10 minutes in our racing. I also know that they have consistently tried to build solid tough engines with spares backup. How many others have been able to do that? To save you having to think about it, I'll tell you. None.

I write this only because I for one am a bit tired of reading some people knocking CMB in the way they are. Its not necessary. If there is some discussion over power output, engine breakages spares supply etc then thats fair comment but this rubbish lately about CMB stealing engines and ripping off others is BS and just gossip between a few buddies on here. Think about this maybe. If CMB wanted to rip off anyone they would have flooded the market with MAC spares which they could do in a heartbeat.

Dave

 

[DaveMarles]

So what your are saying is that cmb is not producing spares for thier mac...opps i mean Cmd......opps i mean Cmb rs.45 mac knock offs

this is not an attack at anyone

but i read in another thread how Stuart barr's feels about knock off's of his stuff

i wonder how he feels about this ?

MAC is an Andy Brown engine not CMB. CMB45RS is a CMB zimmerman disc valve engine. The CMB hydro engine in the pic looks to me like a CMB 45 Hydro with a drum similar to a MAC (also similar to a lot of other drum valves such as the Moki 40 I used a lot of years ago). In fact it looks more like a knock off of the Moki than anything else with that fixed portion to aid gasflow but they probably knocked it off somewhere else just like everyone knocked off the Supertigre idea of ABC piston sleeves and Daimler knocked off crankshaft piston and sleeve from George Stephensons locomotive who took it from James Watt who used the expansion of steam idea from that Greek guy Hero.

Dave

 

[Don Ferrette]

So what your are saying is that cmb is not producing spares for thier mac...opps i mean Cmd......opps i mean Cmb rs.45 mac knock offs

this is not an attack at anyone

but i read in another thread how Stuart barr's feels about knock off's of his stuff

i wonder how he feels about this ?

MAC is an Andy Brown engine not CMB. CMB45RS is a CMB zimmerman disc valve engine. The CMB hydro engine in the pic looks to me like a CMB 45 Hydro with a drum similar to a MAC (also similar to a lot of other drum valves such as the Moki 40 I used a lot of years ago). In fact it looks more like a knock off of the Moki than anything else with that fixed portion to aid gasflow but they probably knocked it off somewhere else just like everyone knocked off the Supertigre idea of ABC piston sleeves and Daimler knocked off crankshaft piston and sleeve from George Stephensons locomotive who took it from James Watt who used the expansion of steam idea from that Greek guy Hero.

Dave

Dave my good friend you're are so correct- "MAC is an Andy Brown engine not CMB" that is fact. However yourself along with a few others are missing the big picture. This has absolutely nothing do with design, it's using something that is not of your property, as in the molds. The Valvola 21 is made directly from the MAC21 molds which do not belong to CMB, they are property of CMDi. Ditto for the "new" 45, that is also out of the MAC molds, real easy to tell just look at the pics & the "description" of this "new" motor. These molds do not belong to CMB, and THAT'S what makes this wrong. Guess those italian boys have little to no respect for some dumb country boy from Live Oak huh? Andy spent alot of time & effort helping CMB develop the hydro CAM engines. It's also funny how once the MAC motors started rolling out the CMB internals started showing similar changes. The green head line showed that, I've had both & you know I ran CMB's for a good while. But that is no big deal either & was expected when you've got two motor lines being built side by side. Who cares if they look similar, all the motors look similar in one way or another & they all run the same way operation wise. Hey my K90's look similar to my MAC84's & 67's, no big deal there. Similar designs are one thing but this is totally different. I was a big fan of CMB for a long time but I've lost pretty much all respect for them in this. You want to use a similar set up on your motors then develop your own parts & make molds. Let me ask you this- would you use someone else's molds to make something & call it your own? How would you feel if I "borrowed" your molds & made exact copies of your rather successful FSR-V hulls & sold them as my "newest" design? <_<

 

[Buckshot]

BLA BLA BLA BLA............

He said, she said, He took, They took, I built, They Built, My motor is better than your motor, their motor is my motor. I'm sick and f'n tired of hear this bulls*!t!!! <_<

Same S*!T, Different Day. :unsure:

-Buck-

 

[DaveMarles]

Dave my good friend you're are so correct- "MAC is an Andy Brown engine not CMB" that is fact. However yourself along with a few others are missing the big picture. This has NOTHING do with design, it's using something that is not of your property, as in the molds. The Valvola 21 is made directly from the MAC21 molds which do not belong to CMB, they are property of CMDi. Ditto for the "new" 45, that is also out of the MAC molds, real easy to tell just look at the pics & the "description" of this "new" motor. These molds do not belong to CMB, and THAT'S what makes this wrong. Guess those italian boys have little to no respect for some dumb country boy from Live Oak huh? Andy spent alot of time & effort helping CMB develop the hydro CAM engines. It's also funny how once the MAC motors started rolling out the CMB internals started showing very similar changes. The green head line clearly showed that, I've had both & you know I ran CMB's for a good while. But that is no big deal either & was expected when you've got two motor lines being built side by side. Who cares if they look similar, all the motors look similar in one way or another & they all run the same way operation wise. Similar designs are one thing but this is totally different. Let me ask you this- would you use someone else's molds to make something & call it your own? How would you feel if I "borrowed" your molds & made exact copies of your rather successful FSR-V hulls & sold them as mine? <_<

Don, I don't miss the point at all, I was just dealing with that particular point about engineering ideas. You think you know what has happened between CMB and Andy Brown and you are quoting what you have been told and then you called CMB thieves. Not your normal way Don. I just think thats going way too far. If I don't know the facts I try to say nothing. You don't know all the facts and thats for sure. This dumb country boy from Edge Green has had boats made from his moulds and sold on the side and of course I didnt like it but you don't know that is the case here. Until you get both sides of the story you could never know and you won't get both sides of the story because CMB would never tell you or even anyone close to them what has gone on. Thats their way.

Dave

 

[Viper40]

BLA BLA BLA BLA............

He said, she said, He took, They took, I built, They Built, My motor is better than your motor, their motor is my motor. I'm sick and f'n tired of hear this bulls*!t!!! <_<

Same S*!T, Different Day. :unsure:

-Buck-

Glad somebody finally spoke up.....

I too, have had about ENOUGH of hearing the same harp playing SAD-SAD music in

almost EVERY single frickin' post that just happens to mention CMB.....

Everyone has an opinion.....KEEP THEM TO YOURSELVES....unless somebody asks you

directly.

 

[Don Ferrette]

This dumb country boy from Edge Green has had boats made from his moulds and sold on the side and of course I didnt like it but you don't know that is the case here..................

Dave you're a good friend & we've had good dealings together for years but let me put it to you this way- I've held both the MAC21 & CMB Valvola 21 in my hands & besides the 2 different color water jackets & carbs, if neither case had a name on it you would not be able to easily tell them apart. h34r:

 

[Don Ferrette]

Everyone has an opinion.....KEEP THEM TO YOURSELVES....unless somebody asks you

directly.

.......... and that would be your opinion on the subject.

While some topics are not the greatest, without opinions there would be little advancement. Every idea starts out as an opinion on some subject. Plus it's a little thing called freedom of speech. If you don't like it, then don't read it.

 

[Chris Wood]

I understand both side's of what little i have read or heard.. When you get right down to it, it is bad for both sides of business.. you have one company that is producing motors and some people are not happy with them.. you have another company that is trying to produce motors and it is a tuff situation..

I personally feel like stu does.. The main issue i have with it is the fact that most HYDRO'S, the cowls will not fit now or the rear sponson tube will be in the way..

REMEMBER, it is like a land slide. The manufacter changed this and now the boat company's have to change there stuff, and so on and so on..

anyway you look at it IT IS A PAIN IN THE A$$.

Chris

 

[waltr]

"CMB would never tell you or even anyone close to them what has gone on. Thats their way."

Hmm........ Than is CMB standing behind there "new" products or hiding behind them? :huh:

Sorry to offend any innocent parties,but I'm a US manufacturer and I just don't like what I see.My opinion,don't like it,don't read it!

I've had plenty of my designs knocked off overseas from my machine shop.Don't like it.Never will.I have a reason for MY opinion.The only way MY opinion will be changed,is for CMB to prove me wrong.

Who am I? Just call me Joe consumer. I have over 35 boats and over 50 motors.So,people like me do matter.

And so does my opinion. If no one changes it,it remains.

As they say,a picture is worth a thousand words. Just look at it. Compare the motors.

Andy nor Don had anything to do with my opinions.

Competition is great! Glad to see it.But,I know what side of the fence I'm sittin on.

 

[shann harrison]

Just my two 2cents but after looking at the pic of this new c.m.b. I think Dave Marles is right it looks like a moki product with c.m.b's flare. I'm not bashing anyone one but this has gone on to long beatin up C.M.B & Andy.I was under the impression this was a hobby????????? :angry: Are we still not having fun with boats or what??? :unsure: It must be along winter.All we do is sound like a bunch of women fightin over who's recipe is better.

 

[waltr]

We're just havin a ball! .Aren't we?

Subject dropped for now. B)

 

[Viper40]

Everyone has an opinion.....KEEP THEM TO YOURSELVES....unless somebody asks you

directly.

.......... and that would be your opinion on the subject.

While some topics are not the greatest, without opinions there would be little advancement. Every idea starts out as an opinion on some subject. Plus it's a little thing called freedom of speech. If you don't like it, then don't read it.

How is this "advancement" ????

Unfortunately, in order to find out if you like it or not...you have to read it...

How about you put as a first line "...just ANOTHER CMB bashing comment..."

And then I will be happy not to read it.

Do you get some sort of commision for every time you mention "stole" or "copied" ???

I know, I know.....just a hobby.

If ya' aint got nutin' nice to say....don't say nutin' at all.....

 

[carlnoki]

hey Shann;

bet my recipe for enchiladas is better than yours. :lol:

carl

 

[Viper40]

hey Shann;

bet my recipe for enchiladas is better than yours. :lol:

carl

HEY, HEY...don't change the subject.....LOL.

We NEED to get this all out now so that MAYBE....we can be done with it

once and for all.