Wire Drives Taking the spotlight.

[jwohlt5362]

Just wanted to see if anyone uses wire drives and what they think. I have built many for me and others and they seem to be doing well. I still use flex cable for the cat hulls but any other hull can run them just fine.

With Tom at Octura coming out with a new coupler and stub I would think the wire will be the choice of racers soon.

I actually made one from a SS bike spoke and used the nipple from the wheel. If you reverse the nipple it becomes a coupler to slip in a Flex Hex .150. The cool thing is you can unscrew the spoke from the nipple to remove your wire nd prop and never touch the coupler at the motor. Just don't use reverse!

I am probably going to have some stubs made up to use with the 2mm wire. They will fit the Fuller/hughey struts but you are better off having a strut with a bearing like BBY sells or I make.

For LSH and riggers they are great. I run them in bearing struts now and they are smooth.

 

[forresterace]

Hi Jeff

Welcome to IW. Glad you could make it and we look forward to hearing some more of your expertise with making your own wire drives.

Would it be possible for you to post ant pictures of your components and set-ups?

How much curve is it possible to put in the 2mm SS wire? I just got out my trusty decimal equivalent charts and see that 2mm is .078" - a little heavier than 1/16".

 

[MikeP]

Cool idea with the spoke, what size brass tube do you use for a stuffing box?

Do you seal the wire at the motor? I thought I saw a picture with a piece of fuel line over it.

Mike

 

[Paul Pachmayer]

Hey Guys,

I'm still not sold on wire drives. My biggest gripe is you have to work within the limits of the wires bend radius. The way I like to run my drives wire isn't an option so I use flex. Any well setup drive will be competitive so until I can see a major advantage to running wire I'll stick to flex.

Paul.

 

[jwohlt5362]

I was trying to post some pics but the board won't do it now. You can hit my logo and then go to hardware and then go to the bottom of the page. I will have some new pics but I use a nice coupler that has 2 set screws on the motor end and 4 on the wire. They don't slip.

Also the stub is drilled on a lathe and the wire goes all the way to the threads.

I use 1/8" K&S for the stuffing tubes with no teflon and use a bearing strut...no teflon bearing. BBY has these and I make my own...big difference in resistance at the strut with real bearings.

They can take a pretty good bend before any problems. I like them because the are strong, cheap, little resistance and very light.

I also have an old style that is easy to make

with just brass and they fit a regular 1/8" coupler...cheap and parts from the local hardware store..maybe a buck to make. I will be putting this back o n my site next week.

My new stubs are built for the Fuller strut and are drilled all the way thru the stub.

They are the hot set up for hydros and riggers...they work just as well in monos.

I also use cable on all my cats. All others are or will be running wire.

 

[jwohlt5362]

So let's see if i can post a pic

 

[jwohlt5362]

Nope...I have to learn that one

 

[Guest]

how thick would that wire be in millimeters?

Do you think it would work with a .15 nitro engine aswell, or is it just for electrics?

 

[Finne]

^^^ That post was me BTW.

seems like the "keep logged in" thing doesn't work :unsure:

 

[jwohlt5362]

I am not sure I would try it on a nitro. It may be fine for the .12.15 motors but anything higher should run .130 or larger cable.

The collet at the motor would be the hard part to make it work.

 

[Guest]

Jeff wouldnt the wire work better with nitro, because of the softer starts?

Much less shock to the drive train.

Steven Vaccaro

www.OffshoreElectrics.com

 

[jwohlt5362]

My only thought is on nitro is that the load range and vibration a nitro hits is rough compared to an electric...heck just starting them they could scream several thousand rpms and then we throw it in the water running a 2000 rpm. Never do that with FE.

Most of my comment is based on Shock factor..not rpm, etc.

Worth a try but couplers are hard to find for those to fit 1/16" wire...then again..maybe it can be made.

If I would I would bump it up to .78 or so...not 1/16" wire.

 

[Guest_crowebar]

Hey Guys,
I'm still not sold on wire drives. My biggest gripe is you have to work within the limits of the wires bend radius. The way I like to run my drives wire isn't an option so I use flex. Any well setup drive will be competitive so until I can see a major advantage to running wire I'll stick to flex.

Paul.

Paul, that is great. I feel the same way, although I was going to say I'm not good enough to run a wire drive.

IF, you knew the exact angle and depth of your strut I'll bet the wire or straight shaft would be the fastest setup. I've never been lucky or good enough to build a boat that didn't need some strut adjustment.

Then there are lifting VS non lifting props (those will take different strut angles) and what if you add more cells, perhaps your 6 cell rigger also runs in 8 cells? More power, different CG etc. etc.

Lets just say I like to keep my options open.

Dick

 

[jwohlt5362]

There is nothing hard about adjusting these drives. I understand Paul does not run teflon, nor do I. Not using teflon is a plus for free running drives. Not for everyone. Any boats I have built for people I usually use teflon because it is easier to adjust.

I agree...you won't find a faster smooth drive than hardshaft with bearings in the shaft and strut or wiredrive. I just won't build anymore struts with teflon coated bearings...there is sooo much difference.

Dick, I would be glad to set you up with one to put in that fast Bardahl you have with the 700 motor. Another neat thing is the stuffing tube for wire is only 1/8" so it is very small under the hull.

Don't get me wrong...I still use flex on many boats. Hydros and riggers are the best for wire...monos work well too. I don't use them on cats but they will work fine as long as no S bends and the J bend is smooth.

Trying to put an image on it. These are for Octura struts but I am now building them for the Fuller Hughey struts.

[/img]

 

[jwohlt5362]

Wow...I missed the REAL message in Dicks post. He and Paul agree on something!!! I'm kidding...just had to give you both that one.

 

[jwohlt5362]

One other point I missed...wire is MUCH better balanced for high rpm running. How many flex cables blew at the SAWS? Even a bulky .130 cable won't handle the power much over 16 cells. Weight is also an issue.

 

[crowebar]

Jeff, That is a good looking sysem and I totally agree, from a performance standpoint the wire is more efficient. Still, the latitude of adjustment range is very limited. I am a real strut adjustment geek. Boat ride is is what really gets me going in this sport. The amount of change I made to my Cabover 24 to convert it from a B50 to a SS1 the morning before the class ran at nats would not have been possible short of some reconstruction. NOW, I would consider replacing the flex with the wire since I know where I like the strut for the 700. Too bad it's way off from the Hacker setup.

I have had several wire drives. They are nice, but for me (the strut geek) I'll keep the flex as my primary systems.

So, that said, maybe I should try a wire for my cabover. It won't change it much now and I'd hate to think I'm so closed minded that I won't try something different.

Hey, Paul and I agree all the time. Well, except for the gear drives and Hitec radios and......

I do think Paul is a cool guy? hope he agrees to that!

Dick

 

[Paul Pachmayer]

Hello Guys,

I do think Paul is a cool guy? hope he agrees to that!

Not sure what to make of the ? mark. lol

My good freind Doug switched over to wire drives so I've seen them in practice. His cabover gave him fits and he about gave up on it, not sure if he resolved the problem. As soon as Octura has their stubs done I'll give it a go on something just to try it, maybe on a rigger.

TTYL, Paul.

 

[jwohlt5362]

If adjustment is what you want to make easy then use the .98 stuffing tube set up with teflon and leave about the same teflon exposed at the strut.

I did hear Doug was having problems with his and I think even broke or something. I pretty much figured it was not cleaned well or he did not use Locite. I put visegrips on mine and make a pretzel out of the wire or break it yet the stub remains ok.

I spoke with Tom at Octura yesterday for way too long but his is getting his couplers hardened and they should be done in a couple weeks.

We spoke about stubs. Trudy has known what I have been doing with their stubs for some time. Mine are drilled all the way to the threads. Since Tom has decided to do his stubs then I am building the wire drives to fit the Fuller/Hughey struts....it will also allow me to drill all the way thru the stub so a person can silver solder both ends if they like...I still like the Loctite 603 but this will allow the 603 to spread better throughout the stub as it is slid in and out. (Or do both...loctite and silver solder) Which is probably what I will do anyway.

Is is worth changing them all over just to see if you can go faster? I doubt it, but for me...I like to piddle and build things that are easy and cheap and work. Heck Doug Twaits Sr. and Jr were breaking records with these years ago. And wiredrives are still breaking records. They are more efficient than any other drive out there besides a hardshaft with bearings.

I am still wondering if after a bit of time that those Octura couplers will start to slip...these set screw couplers won't.

I still think one of the best ugrades so far is bearings in the strut...real bearings.

I was kidding about you and Paul...I based most of my comment of you all and your extreme bench racing series.

Good to see you here, Dick. Hope the family is doing well. Let me know if you would like to play with one of these and I will be glad to send you one for either Octura or Fuller strut.

 

[jwohlt5362]

Paul...if you are running hughey or Fuller struts then forget the Octura size (too long) and get one of mine made for those struts. I will have some done soon.