"F" hydro

[riph]

NAMBA times each boat in a heat race and has a record of the fastest boat in heat racing for each class. These are the best times for a six laps heat race at the 2004 NAMBA Nationals. NAMBA runs the Gas and Nitro boats at the same Nationals but do not run Gas in the X (F) Nitro Class.

X Mono (IMPBA F) 1:26:28 = 86.28 seconds For 6 laps Avg. 14.38 sec./lap

G-1 Gas Mono(LS-27) 1:33:78 = 93.78 seconds " Avg. 15.63 sec./lap

GX-1 Gas Mono(XLS-27)1:32:08 = 92.08 seconds " Avg. 15.35 sec./lap

X Rigger (IMPBA F) 1:07:04 = 67.04 seconds " Avg. 11.17 sec./lap

G-1 Gas Rigger(LS-27)1:17:44 = 77.44 seconds " Avg. 12.9 sec./lap

GX-1 Gas Rigger(XLS-27) 1:26:99 = 86.99 seconds " Avg. 14.5 sec./lap

G-1 Gas Sport Hydro(LS-27) 1:28:07 = 88.7 seconds " Avg. 14.78 sec./lap

 

[Joe Warren]

Looks like after a conversation with the New Slidell Lousianna Club director. The Gas boaters will run in OPEN Classes if they want to mix it up with the Nitro boats @ the Spring Extravazanga Race March 19-20....... As for the Hydro Invite Race in November..... Either the same will be posted on the Race Flier or a NITRO Only Race....... SEEMS THE TABLES ARE TURNING.....

 

[RUNNERX]

I'm sorry I even started this thread.

 

[Chris Herzog]

I'm all for the SGRA to have the Hydro Invitational an all Nitro race because I don't care if they do or don't.....Don't count on it happening though.

That was also another suggestion made during a heated conversation at a club meeting the other night.

First off let me say that I made the race flyer for the March race and I was the one that left the F-class needs to be nitro on the flyer, period! No one else had a hand in that. I'm a mostly gas/ sometimes nitro guy and I alone did that.

I am also running the Gas Nats at our pond this year and have gone to two other clubs to recruit workers for the event because I know what kind of help I can expect from our own guys (not pointing any fingers). But let me make one thing clear about the SGRA.

We are a club of about 50/50 gas and nitro. All the gas guys are active members and about 2% of the nitro guys are active. If the November race was to go just nitro, you can bet that there will be NO Race in November. So while you continue to through fuel on that fire, one that does not need your help to get any worst than it already is.....remember this....if you have been enjoying yourself at our pond weather it be in March or November over the last 5 years, you might want to reframe from biting the hand that feeds you. There have been a hell of allot more gas guys working and keeping things up and going than there has been nitro at that lake in particular. Just food for thought, take it like you want and if you want things to turn for the worst at that lake, keep on going down that path.

MARK MY WORDS!!!!!

Chris Herzog

Former President of the SGRA

 

[JJ Martin]

As far as I'm concerned they can run in F hydro, I have never had any problems with the gas guy's and this whole gas verses nitro issue just needs to die. F hydro is open to engine 30cc and below. You also have to realize that this would open up the ability of the weedwacker style engines to run nitro based fuels in the f class. B)

 

[Nitro20001]

As far as I'm concerned they can run in F hydro, I have never had any problems with the gas guy's and this whole gas verses nitro issue just needs to die. F hydro is open to engine 30cc and below. You also have to realize that this would open up the ability of the weedwacker style engines to run nitro based fuels in the f class.  B)

83513[/snapback]

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Hey gang,

just wanted to say "wow, what a thread." NitrosLady and I have always wondered what it would be like to drive across the country to an event only to be told we can't run. Hope this won't happen to us or anyone else. I run both nitro and gas and find that after a heat of racing my gas boat, I have time to go help someone else, or corner judge, or play CD. We have faith in the boating community that all this will turn out for the battah.

 

[aamick1971]

ok!!!!!!!!!! i read most of the post on this topic,gasser dont like nitro guys,nitro guys dont like gasser. to me it like this we have impba,namba,and apba right?why dont some old fart that runs these boat,and that got plenty of money start up a santion body for gas and only gas !!!! come guys put a little effort in it ,it could happen!the names for it[/b]nagmba or imgba.

 

north

american

gas

model

boat

assocation

ok guys this just my 2 cents!! what do i know anyway iam just a stupid .20 tunnel boat racer

 

[EatMyShortsRacing]

I really can't understand what would compell people to run a boat in an entirely different class.  It's a shallow victory at best. The majority of times if a gas boat won a race it would be due to DNF's.
(I wouldn't / can't run my 90 mono against the 25cc Gas / petrol mono's and I've only got a 15cc K90 in mine.    )

I'm yet to figure out why people want to convert a gas engine like a zenoah that uses piston induction to run on a different fuel and fit glow plugs to it? Why not utilise the engineering involved on something that can supply decent inlet timing? Don't get me wrong - I'm not having a shot at anyone, and the zenoah is a great engine for what it's designed to do. Knowing what a difference adjusting the inlet timing can make on a 2 stroke makes me think this way.

83402[/snapback]

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Say that again when you own a non piston induction gas motor... LOL

Hey if the gas classes go to 35cc then if you guys are serious about all this run gas or nitro crap then I get to run a twin cube rigger??? that falls under 35cc albeit over the current F class limit. But that limit would seem stupid if it is meant to be the "unlimited class" and there is another gas class with a higher displacement allowable?????

*throws the size 6 hook into the lake*

EMS Racing gone fishing again!!!

 

[EatMyShortsRacing]

ok!!!!!!!!!! i read most of the post on this topic,gasser dont like nitro guys,nitro guys dont like gasser. to me it like this we have impba,namba,and apba right?why dont some old fart that runs these boat,and that got plenty of money start up a santion body for gas and only gas !!!! come guys put a little effort in it ,it could happen!the names for it[/b]nagmba or imgba. 

north                                 

american

gas

model

boat

assocation

  ok guys this just my 2 cents!! what do i know anyway iam just a  stupid .20 tunnel boat racer

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Yes just spread the already thinning boating population over more associations...

 

And have more differences in the rules so it is almost impossible to race in a different association....

 

Create even more division between the camps....

 

Beat ones head against a brick wall coz it ends up being less painful????

 

[EatMyShortsRacing]

Man I am ON FIRE today!!!!! hehehehe

All I really have to say is the classes are what the classes are.... dont try to change the 'spirit of the law' on technicalities.... we all know what the idea of the rules are and that means F class is Nitro only. F class has enough problems with a single .80 having to race against twin .90s why try to make it even more complex?

If you wanna race gas against nitro on a club level or even at a major event go for it.... but it is not a sanctioned class. The classes exist for national competition for both Nitro and Gas... what more do you want???? Maybe you wanna see a "top gun" race at the end of the meet.... top nitro against top gas... and that could be a fun race.... but thats all it is... a FUN RACE....

The more you ***** about classes, restrictions, "I wanna run Y in Z class" the less guys you are going to have to race against....

 

[Grub]

Something to think about.

Run gas and nitro together but give a trophy to the first three gas and first three nitro boats in each class, say F or X hydro or whatever it is, then have one overall trophy for the winner of that class.

This way everyone gets to run against each other and creates some better racing by having more boats in each heat when the numbers are down plus too then we can see which boat was better on the day. Plus stops all the BS about quick Gas boats or reliable nitro boats.

But someone will have to change the rules to make this happen.

Grub

 

[EatMyShortsRacing]

Something to think about.
Run gas and nitro together but give a trophy to the first three gas and first three nitro boats in each class, say F or X hydro or whatever it is, then have one overall trophy for the winner of that class.

This way everyone gets to run against each other and creates some better racing by having more boats in each heat when the numbers are down plus too then we can see which boat was better on the day. Plus stops all the BS about quick Gas boats or reliable nitro boats.

But someone will have to change the rules to make this happen.

Grub

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I thought you of all people would bite harder!!!!

 

[Grub]

But you're right Craig.

If thats what the rules are, then that is what they are until they are changed using the correct system.

Let everyone have their vote and if it is passed then all-in together if not then don't try to merge them again.

Grub - Don't jump the start because the CDs decision is final

 

[EatMyShortsRacing]

Grub - Don't jump the start because the CDs decision is final

83526[/snapback]

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You dont have to tell me that...

 

[Danny Bull]

I am also running the Gas Nats at our pond this year and have gone to two other clubs to recruit workers for the event because I know what kind of help I can expect from our own guys (not pointing any fingers).

Hi Chris,

I turned 42 last week and I've never been in an aeroplane. If you guys cough up the dollars for the return tickets, I'll organize the event, happily take abuse as CD, run the lunch time BBQ and clean your boats at the end of the day.

Good help is so hard to find.

Cheers, Danny.

 

[Joe Warren]

Seems this post got a lot of attention over the weekend with over 100 post. If someone got Mad it was not our intent..... But it does make one stop & look at the rules and the way they are written. At best untill the Present board changes the rules. It is up to the Clubs to Do what Ever is needed....... So before you blow a Gasket, Oring, or other... Consider what you need to do on a Club Level... I race a lot out of town... I dont have any say about the Classes. Just Show Up & Race..... Someone makes all those decisions long before we arrive...

 

[Preston_Hall]

As far as current rules go the arguement is that:

Gas can race with nitro when they want but nitro can't run with gas when they want.

Well,

1/8 scales can run with .60 hydros when they want.

Tunnels can run with riggers when they want.

Cats can run with hydros when they want.

Sport 40 runs with hydros when they want.

But hydros can never run with those classes.

Now here is something else to consider. In the IMPBA rulebook section "H" Nitro Specialized Classes:

Nitro Specialized Classes

 

Model Offshore Power Boat Racing

 

Hulls

1. IMPBA legal Mono and Catamaran hulls.

2. The use or inclusion of stepped (Deep Vee) mono hull in the gas offshore classes.

Why does it even mention gas in these rules when it clearly states nitro? Is gas allowed in this "specialized nitro class"? #2 seems to separate gas and nitro. But then in the next section:

Engines

Any IMPBA legal engine, including gasoline

Wouldn't any reference to gas be in the LSG section? You see, even in the ever so clear "specialized NITRO classes" it is not clear at all. Is this an open mono and cat class with racing schemes? Or an open nitro mono and cat with racing schemes?

In the same section "H" you find:

1/8 Scale Unlimited Hydroplane Rules

 

Engine and Boat Specifications

 

5. Engine must correspond with IMPBA Class "E".

Is this a nitro only class? Wait before you answer.

And also,

Sportsman Hydro (Sport 40 Hydroplane)

 

Engine Specifications

1. IMPBA D class engine shall be used.

2. Twin engine installations are not allowed in Sport 40.

They seem to be very specific as to how the size engine is obtained. Nitro only? Wait.

Same section "H"

Sport Outboard Tunnel Rules

 

Engine Specifications

 

4. The following exceptions will be allowed in the Sport Outboard Tunnel

specifications.

 

d. Any glow plug, fuel brand and mixture.

This seems to be vary specific as to "glow". Obviously no gas. Another example in the same section "H":

Production ABS

 

Propulsion and Control Systems

 

Single glow engines with a maximum displacement of 0.165 cubic inches may be utilized.

Again very specific to what type of engine. So the question is, Why should the engine classes not include gas as it stands now? Gas is obviously included in even the "Specialized Nitro Classes" Section "H" and the rule book is very specific as to when it is not.

Section "F"

 

General Rules of Competition

 

LIMITATION OF ENTRIES

 

SECTION 2

 

A. A boat may be run in more than one engine class by changing engines to comply with cubic inch requirements.

Nothing about fuel there.

Gas boaters as well as nitro boaters help organized gas classes. It seems the reason for this was to give the slow @$$ saps somewhere to run their boats and keep out of the way. Well now they are faster than before and faster than nitro in a lot of cases and all-of-a-sudden the world is coming to an end for the presumed nitro classes. A few others have pointed out how we are outcasting the others but NOBODY has given any reason why a gas BOAT should not run with a NITRO boat.

I want to jump the fence now. Assume this does mean nitro and gas classes. NO GREY AREA!

1. Displacement

The cubic inch displacement of a power plant shall be the sum total of the displacement

of all cylinders in the power plant. The cubic inch displacement of multi-cylinder

engines, two or more engines driving attached together and two or more engines driving

separate propellers will be added together to determine the total displacement and thus

the class the power will run in. To determine engine class, read calculated engine

displacement to three decimal places, drop all remaining figures.

2. Internal Combustion Engine Classes

Class Cubic Inch Displacement Metric Class

A 0.000 thru 0.129 2.1 CC

B 0.130 thru 0.219 3.5 CC

C 0.220 thru 0.300 4.9 CC

D 0.301 thru 0.458 7.5 CC

E 0.459 thru 0.670 11.0 CC

F 0.671 thru 1.830 30.0 CC

Formulas: CC X .061 = CID, CID divided by .061 = CC

Note: For Large Scale Gasoline engine classes see section “I”, Large Scale Gasoline.

 

Fuel

Pump gasoline and your choice of oil mix shall be used. No nitro additives allowed in all gas engine

classes.

Does the fuel rule now mean that a previously legal spark ignition motor with a little nitro added is now nothing but an illegal LSG engine? It would have to be, right?

It doesn't even seem as though anybody has asked:

[SIZE=14pt]Bill Zuber,[/SIZE]

What is the answer? Is gas allowed in the A-F classes?

That was easy.

 

[bzubee]

Preston I am not getting into this topic on this thread it has gone the same way the noise issue went and that worked out fine. It is strickly up to the clubs to put exceptions to rules on their flyers. The rulebook is a tool and guide.

I do want to point out the fact that I find most impressive is that Joe Warren and Don both finally agree on the same issue. Must be a full moon!

Bill Zuber

 

[Preston_Hall]

Bill will be one of the good ones. He is active in the sport and gives answers that keep everybody happy. And with that, the end of an 8 page discussion . Well, until Don get's wind of my post. :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[gene gager]

:unsure: please help me,, I run my CMB green head on gas oil mix but after reading all these post I am lost on which will be faster in it? nitro or gas? I always wondered why people got mad at me when I ran over their boat, but now its clear, it wasn't the boat damage I inflicked on them, it was the fuel I was running. :lol: