Aero Marine Mean Machine Cat Project

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scboatman00

Active Member
Joined
Jan 31, 2006
Messages
39
I have been working on a 29" Mean Machine Cat by Aeromarine Laminates. I have been trying to get it upto 60+ MPH in order to race with Nitro Hydros in the area that I live. I am looking for a motor recommendation that will allow me to have 60+ MPH runs in excess of 4 minutes. Curtrently I have a Hacker 77 ESP. I also have props from 40 mm upto 47 mm. I have been looking to a Lener 2250 motor , but do not know enough about the motors. I also open to a Hacker motor as well. Any recommendations are appreciated.

Thanks.

r,

SCboatman
 
I can give you one example: I run a 2250/16 on 24 cells with a x445 for 4+ minutes in a Titan 40.

Does about 40mph. I am pulling about 50 amps. I was going to run this set-up in a No Step 4 on a 10S lipo Pack. Pulling about 75 amps. I was aming for upper 50's to run with the nitro guys. I am only looking for a 2 minute duration though.

Brooks93 over on RR will have better info. He has done similar.

HT
 
You could also give Fine Design a call. Chris sells the hull and has quite a bit of experience with the big stuff.

Don't use email to contact them. Chris isn't an email kind of guy. www.finedesignrc.com
 
I can give you one example: I run a 2250/16 on 24 cells with a x445 for 4+ minutes in a Titan 40.

Does about 40mph. I am pulling about 50 amps. I was going to run this set-up in a No Step 4 on a 10S lipo Pack. Pulling about 75 amps. I was aming for upper 50's to run with the nitro guys. I am only looking for a 2 minute duration though.

Brooks93 over on RR will have better info. He has done similar.

HT
Stupid question, but how are you reading the motor charts for the Lehner motors? I understand the the less number of windings, the lower the resistance. Also, less windings tend to lend to move RPM's per volt. So why not go to a 2250/11 or 2250/10. This is what I am struggling with. I can't seem to find enough information to allow me to compare apples to apples. Thanks for the info. I appreciate the reply.

v/r

SCboatman

You could also give Fine Design a call. Chris sells the hull and has quite a bit of experience with the big stuff.

Don't use email to contact them. Chris isn't an email kind of guy. www.finedesignrc.com
Isn't there anyone else that might have some idea of boat set-ups? I see that you have found one of the same issues that I have with Chris Fine (re: email). He may hold 11 records, but everytime I talk to him about about the same setup, I get a different story and I get the feeling that if I don't ask the right question, I don;t get an answer I am looking for. Don't even get me started on the screw, nuts, etc that come with the hardware I received from him. Always inconsistant and often missing needed items.

This may come out too strong, but Chris Fine cannot be the only one out there that has any notion of FE set-ups.

Has anyone else been racing Nitros with FEs?

Thanks,

SCBoatman
 
Isn't there anyone else that might have some idea of boat set-ups? I see that you have found one of the same issues that I have with Chris Fine (re: email). He may hold 11 records, but everytime I talk to him about about the same setup, I get a different story and I get the feeling that if I don't ask the right question, I don;t get an answer I am looking for. Don't even get me started on the screw, nuts, etc that come with the hardware I received from him. Always inconsistant and often missing needed items.
yes you need to ask the right questions. He can't read minds but, knowing Chris the way I do I am sure he is saying something to the effect that you won't get a mean machine into the 60's for 4 mins. I haved raced a mean machine with 18 cells in a 4 min race and its all you can do to keep it on the water and thats at 40 mph

as far as screws with hardware. Get a good supply of what you like and discard what comes with it if you don't like it. Everyone has a faviorite way of putting on hardware.. Mine is blind nuts others its lock nuts.

a mean machine is to small to race at 60mph and a 2250 would be to big for the boat.

if you want to race at 60 you better be ready to spend about 2000 on motor, lipos or matched cells and a 40-160 plus a 36"+ boat.

I haved raced the gas/nitro guys at the internats and the INDY races last summer. even a 36" boat is small in that chop and at those speeds. If you want a cat then look at a team believer or avenger. both have been raced in the high 50's to low 60's already with electric power but, are big enough to handle the race waters.

as far as setups look at the 2280/11 or /12 with a prop around a x447 or x450 with a 40-160.

or a Plettenberg 370/50/A1s witha x455 to x457

or the Neu Bam motor not sure on the prop since I have not personally ran the motor

you will have to pull a good amount of amps and a hacker 77 will not cut it for a 4 min race under that kind of load. it will over heat quickly.

so if you want to play with the nitro/gas guys I hope your not on a budget.

Now you could probably get your mean machine into the 40's on 18 cells and race a .21 nitro boat.

I would probably run a Hacker 10,11, or 12 xl with a x442, x445, or x447 depending on the motor.

or use a lehner 1940/10, /11, or /12 with the same props

If you are seriously wanting to be in the 60's with electric then call Chris and tell him " I want a 60 mph boat that will run for 4 mins so I can race the nitro/gas guys. What would you recommend for boat, motor, cells, esc and hardware?"

all of this of course is just my opinion and what I have experienced. There is always more then one way to skin a cat.
 
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Hi SCboatman,

I've raced (and beat) both nitro and gas boats in the open classes. What you want to do with the mean machine is a strech. I race a Mean Machine but I run 18 cells in it, low to mid 40s for 4 minutes. Kelly was right on the money, to run 60 for 4 minutes you'll need a bigger boat, more cells and a motor/speedo to handle the load. To run in the nitro classes you only need about 2 1/2 minutes of run time which one set of cells will handle, I think 4 minutes will need 2 sets paralleled to acheve the same speeds.

Paul.
 
Paul and Kelly have some of the most experience in doing what you want to achieve SC.

They have pushed the limits in FE to race with the Nitro/Gas guys.
 
I sincerely appreciate all of ya'lls help. You are answering some questions that have been rolling around in my head. Not too many FE'ers in SC. I am rethinking my strategy. With the larger boats (i.e. Avenger and Cyclone, etc) are you using one or two motors? Are you using geard drives or straight drives?

WRT the motos, how are the different brand names related? For example, do the Hacker Motors deliver more torque thatn the Nemisis....and Lehner motor provide more torque per volt than Hacker? It seems like a lot of serious boaters are using the Lehner motors.

Thanks again. I really appreciate the schoolin'.

v/r

SCboatman
 
the bigger cats I have seen and or ran are running a single big electric motor. A single motor setup is easier to setup, maintain, and cheaper. plus the speed is about the same

hackers and nemsis motors are pretty much the same from what I have seen. I perfer lehner myself but, I do own hackers, nemesis, lehner, plettenberg and neu motors. They are all good motors but, for big boat applications hacker and nemesis don't make motors that will make the kinda power you will need to race the gas/nitro guys unless your racing .21 through .46 nitros.

the 22 and 30 seires lehners are big powerful motors. the Bam motor from neu is also a big motors and so is the Plettenberg 370/50 series

most of the electric that are racing the nitro/ gas guys are running direct drive setups because the gears on the transmissions don't last to long under that kinda power load.

IMO the lehners have more torque then a hacker but, I can't prove it. now the Plet has a ton more torque then a lehner but, the rpm isn't as high so what you pick will depend on the application you need it for and the prop you want to swing

The Neu motors will have more torque then the hackers or nemsis or lehners due to there design.

and the plett should have more torque then the plettenberg. (don't know for sure since I have not ran or seen a BAM run)

the more poles that are in the motor generally means more torque. Neus are 4 poles, Hacker , lehner, and nemesis are 2 pole and Plettenbergs are 8 or 10 poles.
 
Hi SC,

To make it simple for you an Avenger cat, a 2280/11 and 32 cells x2 would get you 60 plus for over 4 minutes easy. ;) Now to handle that amount of power I would strongly suggest a Schultze 40/160 controller. I have run that combo on a Hacker Navy 77 with little problems but it's really pushing the limits of that controller. Your really looking at the high end of FE racing but it sure is fun to drill a nitro or gas boat with electric power. I never get tired of seeing the look on a fuel racer or the comments that follow after a good heat. :D

Paul.
 
SCboatman,

come on down to Blue Lake, I-75 Exit 13 in Valdosta, March 3, 4, and 5 for the I.M.P.B.A. Fast Electric-II SAWS...

there will be a sampling of high cell count, high speed, fast electric boats running, cats, monos and sport hydro's, you'll have the opportunity to see first hand and talk to the folks that set them up...

Ron
 
Good thread.

Paul & Kelly thanks for sharing the info!

By the way there is a site selling the aero 29" cat that say it will go 40 to 50mph with a 700 and 12-18 cells.

Steven
 
By the way there is a site selling the aero 29" cat that say it will go 40 to 50mph with a 700 and 12-18 cells.
IIRC, that's about terminal velocity for an object going over Niagra Falls. ;)
 
By the way there is a site selling the aero 29" cat that say it will go 40 to 50mph with a 700 and 12-18 cells.
IIRC, that's about terminal velocity for an object going over Niagra Falls. ;)
LOL

Paul & Kelly do you guys run similar sized hulls as the nitros in the open class?
 
Paul & Kelly thanks for sharing the info!

By the way there is a site selling the aero 29" cat that say it will go 40 to 50mph with a 700 and 12-18 cells.

Steven
which site is that? the only place I know of that sells FE mean machines is Fines and his doesn't state that under the boat

Paul & Kelly do you guys run similar sized hulls as the nitros in the open class?
yes even the exact same hull sometimes
 
Paul & Kelly thanks for sharing the info!

By the way there is a site selling the aero 29" cat that say it will go 40 to 50mph with a 700 and 12-18 cells.

Steven
which site is that? the only place I know of that sells FE mean machines is Fines and his doesn't state that under the boat

Paul & Kelly do you guys run similar sized hulls as the nitros in the open class?
yes even the exact same hull sometimes
No not Chris. I'm sure he wouldnt do that. I don't want to get into a bashing of sites. Just thought it was funny that you guys are running them with brushless and getting 40mph, but that place can run a can motor and get the same speeds or better.
 
well I would like to see a 700 do that and if it does for how long.

both paul and I ran them in offshore so that a 4 min race. a sprint setup would be faster of course
 
Maybe it was a SAW setup with a 700 motor.

18 cells on a 700 motor? Maybe for one run then change motor.

Larry
 
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that would be about the only way I could see a 700 going that fast

heck the LSH record is 52mph. I can't see a cat being faster then Crowes lsh

never mind page I found the site. thats a pretty tall claim
 
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that would be about the only way I could see a 700 going that fast

heck the LSH record is 52mph. I can't see a cat being faster then Crowes lsh

never mind page I found the site. thats a pretty tall claim
Yes- but they do say 18 cells on a 700 motor? Maybe for one run then change motor.

Larry
 

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