speedmaster hardware

[Steve Seebold]

I personally would like to see the spacing between the main bolt and the shear bolt on the rudder pivots get moved farther apart. While I've used Speedmaster hardware for many years this is one thing I've never liked on the 40 and up rudders and all the copycats keep repeating it. Andy got it right on his CMDi hardware and when he still had his Mazak made me some super nice pivot blocks that would allow me to fit his thinner rudders to SpeedMaster transom brackets. He also supplied the pivot block with both holes small so you could use one block for left or right transom mounting, you just drilled whichever hole wound up on top to the larger main bolt size. I would also like to see the rudder thickness get reduced (like Andy also did) as a .250" trailing edge thickness is too much. Attached is a pic of the CMDi scale rudder assembly (minus blade) on the back of the FE 1/8 scale I'm currently building, I sure wish as do others that they were still available as that's what scale hardware should look like in my opinion.

Less rudder thickness could possibly allow an 8 - 32 water fitting as it seems to be evident now that on many nitro engines more than enough water is being supplied now through the 10- 32 fittings .

The rudders I make for gas boats are .190 to .200 thick with a .125 hole in side and pick up holes.

The leg on my struts are 3/16 thick instead of 5/32 and for 90 boats that leg would be 1/4 inch. They are a few grams heavier than what's out there now, and they are mounted on a 2 axis bracket.

If you have to worry about a few grams, there is something seriously wrong with your set up. It has always been my opinion that if you need the skis to lift the back end of your rigger, there is a major problem with your set up. It could be your strut angle, or the lift in your prop. I'm not a rigger guy so I don't know.

 

[Steve Seebold]

I personally would like to see the spacing between the main bolt and the shear bolt on the rudder pivots get moved farther apart. While I've used Speedmaster hardware for many years this is one thing I've never liked on the 40 and up rudders and all the copycats keep repeating it. Andy got it right on his CMDi hardware and when he still had his Mazak made me some super nice pivot blocks that would allow me to fit his thinner rudders to SpeedMaster transom brackets. He also supplied the pivot block with both holes small so you could use one block for left or right transom mounting, you just drilled whichever hole wound up on top to the larger main bolt size. I would also like to see the rudder thickness get reduced (like Andy also did) as a .250" trailing edge thickness is too much. Attached is a pic of the CMDi scale rudder assembly (minus blade) on the back of the FE 1/8 scale I'm currently building, I sure wish as do others that they were still available as that's what scale hardware should look like in my opinion.

Don, that rudder bracket is no problem. I just need to know how far it is from the transom to the center of the pin hole and the width of the base.

AND, what is the bracket next to the boat?

It's a rear wing stabilizer bracket from Rcboatcompany.

Did you get my email?

Yes I did. Did you get my reply?

 

[Steve Seebold]

OK gentlemen, I accept your challenge. I have 3 jobs in line on the machine right now that should take me about 3 weeks to finish.

After that I will design and build a killer set of hardware for 21, 45 and 67 and 90 boats 67 and 90 hardware can be used on most twins. I will have hardware around the end of February to the middle of March and as I finish parts, I will take pictures and post them here.

Do you prefer square drive or collet drive? I need to know because a strut for a collet drive is considerably longer than the strut for a square drive.

I will no doubt have many questions during the design stages, so I hope everyone will be available to help me.

My deal is and always has been, if you send me hardware to get measurements from, your first set of the new hardware will be free. Contact me before you send anything to be sure I have not already commited to that size stuff

I'm going to make 30 sets of each size hardware because Murphy's law always applies. If I want 25 pieces and I start with 25, I'll end up with 23 or 24, but if I start with 30 pieces, I'll end up with 30 pieces.

I have some stuff in mind that will require me knowing the diameter of the prop you'll be running. I don't need to know the pitch, or the lead angle, JUST the diameter.

 

[Ron Jefferson]

I personally would like to see the spacing between the main bolt and the shear bolt on the rudder pivots get moved farther apart. While I've used Speedmaster hardware for many years this is one thing I've never liked on the 40 and up rudders and all the copycats keep repeating it. Andy got it right on his CMDi hardware and when he still had his Mazak made me some super nice pivot blocks that would allow me to fit his thinner rudders to SpeedMaster transom brackets. He also supplied the pivot block with both holes small so you could use one block for left or right transom mounting, you just drilled whichever hole wound up on top to the larger main bolt size. I would also like to see the rudder thickness get reduced (like Andy also did) as a .250" trailing edge thickness is too much. Attached is a pic of the CMDi scale rudder assembly (minus blade) on the back of the FE 1/8 scale I'm currently building, I sure wish as do others that they were still available as that's what scale hardware should look like in my opinion.

Less rudder thickness could possibly allow an 8 - 32 water fitting as it seems to be evident now that on many nitro engines more than enough water is being supplied now through the 10- 32 fittings .

The rudders I make for gas boats are .190 to .200 thick with a .125 hole in side and pick up holes.

The leg on my struts are 3/16 thick instead of 5/32 and for 90 boats that leg would be 1/4 inch. They are a few grams heavier than what's out there now, and they are mounted on a 2 axis bracket.

If you have to worry about a few grams, there is something seriously wrong with your set up. It has always been my opinion that if you need the skis to lift the back end of your rigger, there is a major problem with your set up. It could be your strut angle, or the lift in your prop. I'm not a rigger guy so I don't know.

Steve,

Worring about a few grams when building riggers is a huge deal in my opinion. To easily grams turn into lbs, bulky hardware in the water causes drag, and riggers without exact set-up run like crap! I'd say 5/32 is a ton and a 1/4 looks insane.

Ron

 

[Don Ferrette]

I personally would like to see the spacing between the main bolt and the shear bolt on the rudder pivots get moved farther apart. While I've used Speedmaster hardware for many years this is one thing I've never liked on the 40 and up rudders and all the copycats keep repeating it. Andy got it right on his CMDi hardware and when he still had his Mazak made me some super nice pivot blocks that would allow me to fit his thinner rudders to SpeedMaster transom brackets. He also supplied the pivot block with both holes small so you could use one block for left or right transom mounting, you just drilled whichever hole wound up on top to the larger main bolt size. I would also like to see the rudder thickness get reduced (like Andy also did) as a .250" trailing edge thickness is too much. Attached is a pic of the CMDi scale rudder assembly (minus blade) on the back of the FE 1/8 scale I'm currently building, I sure wish as do others that they were still available as that's what scale hardware should look like in my opinion.

Don, that rudder bracket is no problem. I just need to know how far it is from the transom to the center of the pin hole and the width of the base.

AND, what is the bracket next to the boat?

Steve you have a p/m.

 

[Don Ferrette]

Don, that rudder bracket is no problem. I just need to know how far it is from the transom to the center of the pin hole and the width of the base.

AND, what is the bracket next to the boat?

It's a rear wing stabilizer bracket from Rcboatcompany.

Yes and while it's very nice I paid out the wazoo to get it as it is only sold as part of the complete kit, all I wanted was the transom plate itself as I have no use for the rest of the pieces including the metal ball ends........

 

[Samuel Hagan JR]

Don, that rudder bracket is no problem. I just need to know how far it is from the transom to the center of the pin hole and the width of the base.

AND, what is the bracket next to the boat?

It's a rear wing stabilizer bracket from Rcboatcompany.

Yes and while it's very nice I paid out the wazoo to get it as it is only sold as part of the complete kit, all I wanted was the transom plate itself as I have no use for the rest of the pieces including the metal ball ends........

I just bought one for my scale from them. That's why I know where there from. Your rudder looks awesome. Seen something similar to that at Hobart. It was on the O'berto.

 

[Steve Seebold]

I personally would like to see the spacing between the main bolt and the shear bolt on the rudder pivots get moved farther apart. While I've used Speedmaster hardware for many years this is one thing I've never liked on the 40 and up rudders and all the copycats keep repeating it. Andy got it right on his CMDi hardware and when he still had his Mazak made me some super nice pivot blocks that would allow me to fit his thinner rudders to SpeedMaster transom brackets. He also supplied the pivot block with both holes small so you could use one block for left or right transom mounting, you just drilled whichever hole wound up on top to the larger main bolt size. I would also like to see the rudder thickness get reduced (like Andy also did) as a .250" trailing edge thickness is too much. Attached is a pic of the CMDi scale rudder assembly (minus blade) on the back of the FE 1/8 scale I'm currently building, I sure wish as do others that they were still available as that's what scale hardware should look like in my opinion.

Less rudder thickness could possibly allow an 8 - 32 water fitting as it seems to be evident now that on many nitro engines more than enough water is being supplied now through the 10- 32 fittings .

The rudders I make for gas boats are .190 to .200 thick with a .125 hole in side and pick up holes.

The leg on my struts are 3/16 thick instead of 5/32 and for 90 boats that leg would be 1/4 inch. They are a few grams heavier than what's out there now, and they are mounted on a 2 axis bracket.

If you have to worry about a few grams, there is something seriously wrong with your set up. It has always been my opinion that if you need the skis to lift the back end of your rigger, there is a major problem with your set up. It could be your strut angle, or the lift in your prop. I'm not a rigger guy so I don't know.

Steve,

Worring about a few grams when building riggers is a huge deal in my opinion. To easily grams turn into lbs, bulky hardware in the water causes drag, and riggers without exact set-up run like crap! I'd say 5/32 is a ton and a 1/4 looks insane.

Ron

Ron, I agree with some of what you said. 5/32 is good for a 20 rigger, for 45 to 67, I would go to 3/16 and for 90's I would go to 1/4 inch. You gotta remember too, when your rigger is running at speed the entire strut should be out of the water.

 

[Ron Jefferson]

I personally would like to see the spacing between the main bolt and the shear bolt on the rudder pivots get moved farther apart. While I've used Speedmaster hardware for many years this is one thing I've never liked on the 40 and up rudders and all the copycats keep repeating it. Andy got it right on his CMDi hardware and when he still had his Mazak made me some super nice pivot blocks that would allow me to fit his thinner rudders to SpeedMaster transom brackets. He also supplied the pivot block with both holes small so you could use one block for left or right transom mounting, you just drilled whichever hole wound up on top to the larger main bolt size. I would also like to see the rudder thickness get reduced (like Andy also did) as a .250" trailing edge thickness is too much. Attached is a pic of the CMDi scale rudder assembly (minus blade) on the back of the FE 1/8 scale I'm currently building, I sure wish as do others that they were still available as that's what scale hardware should look like in my opinion.

Less rudder thickness could possibly allow an 8 - 32 water fitting as it seems to be evident now that on many nitro engines more than enough water is being supplied now through the 10- 32 fittings .

The rudders I make for gas boats are .190 to .200 thick with a .125 hole in side and pick up holes.

The leg on my struts are 3/16 thick instead of 5/32 and for 90 boats that leg would be 1/4 inch. They are a few grams heavier than what's out there now, and they are mounted on a 2 axis bracket.

If you have to worry about a few grams, there is something seriously wrong with your set up. It has always been my opinion that if you need the skis to lift the back end of your rigger, there is a major problem with your set up. It could be your strut angle, or the lift in your prop. I'm not a rigger guy so I don't know.

Steve,

Worring about a few grams when building riggers is a huge deal in my opinion. To easily grams turn into lbs, bulky hardware in the water causes drag, and riggers without exact set-up run like crap! I'd say 5/32 is a ton and a 1/4 looks insane.

Ron

Ron, I agree with some of what you said. 5/32 is good for a 20 rigger, for 45 to 67, I would go to 3/16 and for 90's I would go to 1/4 inch. You gotta remember too, when your rigger is running at speed the entire strut should be out of the water.

Steve

I think you need to consider more when making custom hardware. I'm not sure I've seen a twin with a 1/4" leg on the strut. I've been doing this a long time and can tell you that hardware on the fast boats has come a long way. Take a look at someone like Terry Keeley's .45 hydro that has a .21 size rudder blade on it and turns as well as any. Crapshooters and Eagle SG's have only what's necessary on the transom. If you make generic hardware that will take any and all abuse, trust me it will drag the boat down. As for the strut being totally out of the water at full speed, I doubt that happens more than half the time you're racing. Just something to consider.

Ron

 

[anthony_marquart]

Lets offer input, but let the man design and make his hardware,. My input,.. light, only as strong as needed, minimal drag, and flexible with setup as possible. Rudder, thinner the better,. 20-45 boats don't needs lots of water for cooling.

 

[Steve Seebold]

Lets offer input, but let the man design and make his hardware,. My input,.. light, only as strong as needed, minimal drag, and flexible with setup as possible. Rudder, thinner the better,. 20-45 boats don't needs lots of water for cooling.

Thanks Anthony, I need all the input I can get. As I said before, I run gas boats which are much heavier then your little spindlie nitro riggers.

I'm thinking a 3/32 hole down the back side and the pick up on the rudder and maybe .150 to .155 thick at the trailing edge.

 

[anthony_marquart]

sounds great,.. I run a 0.050 water outlet on .21 cooling head,.. so that should be great..

 

[Ron Jefferson]

I just measured my .21 size rudder. Hole down the back #47 or .078 and pick-up hole in side of rudder #57 or .043. I still restrict the water going to the head on this engine and would recommend it for a .45 as well, although I'd make the .45 blade deeper front to back. .150-.155 looks just about right for rear width. I'm not sure how a drill bit tracks in aluminum but a 3/32 bit held up to the bottom of my rudder doesn't look like it leaves much room for error.

 

[Steve Seebold]

I just measured my .21 size rudder. Hole down the back #47 or .078 and pick-up hole in side of rudder #57 or .043. I still restrict the water going to the head on this engine and would recommend it for a .45 as well, although I'd make the .45 blade deeper front to back. .150-.155 looks just about right for rear width. I'm not sure how a drill bit tracks in aluminum but a 3/32 bit held up to the bottom of my rudder doesn't look like it leaves much room for error.

You gotta remember though, gas runs a lot hotter than nitro, and the smaller the hole, the harder it's going to be to make it go straight. You're OK if you use the right drills, but if you don't, you'll lose 1 out of 5 when the hole breaks through the side of the rudder. There is a drill rhat will drill that will go straight, but they cost about $26.00 each and the best way to ensure that you'll break one when you're 35 miles from the supplier is to buy one. I will always buy at least 4

 

[Ron Jefferson]

I just measured my .21 size rudder. Hole down the back #47 or .078 and pick-up hole in side of rudder #57 or .043. I still restrict the water going to the head on this engine and would recommend it for a .45 as well, although I'd make the .45 blade deeper front to back. .150-.155 looks just about right for rear width. I'm not sure how a drill bit tracks in aluminum but a 3/32 bit held up to the bottom of my rudder doesn't look like it leaves much room for error.

You gotta remember though, gas runs a lot hotter than nitro, and the smaller the hole, the harder it's going to be to make it go straight. You're OK if you use the right drills, but if you don't, you'll lose 1 out of 5 when the hole breaks through the side of the rudder. There is a drill rhat will drill that will go straight, but they cost about $26.00 each and the best way to ensure that you'll break one when you're 35 miles from the supplier is to buy one. I will always buy at least 4

Sorry Steve,

I thought we were still talking nitro stuff. I know nothing about gas.

 

[Tom Foley]

Maybe start a thread about Seebold Hardware by itself ?

 

[Kevin Krogness]

Maybe start a thread about Seebold Hardware by itself ?

I think thats a good idea....

 

[Shane Bastick]

Just wanted to say, Speedmaster makes great hardware, always has and always will, and is one of many good hardware manufacutures out there.

I have read the entire set of comments in this thread, and It just seems very sad to think that , what is only a hobby "effectively toy model boats" can become so serious and so negative.

Very dissapointing to see here on Intl Waters - its a shame this forum thread hasn't been removed from the site.

 

[Steve Seebold]

Maybe start a thread about Seebold Hardware by itself ?

POINT TAKEN.

I've been way under the weather for the last 2 weeks. it's like I said a bad word on here and God has punished me for it.

I have had a really bad cold, that turned into a sinus infection, and if I'm not careful, it will turn into pneumonia.

Please give me a couple of weeks more, and I will start posting some pictures of some of my stuff for everyone to see

 

[Steve Seebold]

OK guys, I did something today I might be regretting in the not too distant future, but what's done is done.

I made a decision in about mid October that I wasn't going to take any more work that wasn't R/C boat related.

Well, I made a choice this evening to to return 2 jobs to the customer. It was hard to do because the total was worth about $4,500.00.

It was good money, but I just don't want to work that hard any more.

Now, I am going to concentrate on resurecting my line of R/C boat hardware. I know I made a pretty harsh statement a few days ago, and now it's time for me to put up or shut up. So, I'm going to put up. I can't make as much product as Speedmaster or as inexpensively because I only have one CNC machine, so I'm just going to have to make it better.

I have some GAS hardware to finish that will take me 7 or 8 days, then I'm going to make some nitro hardware. A couple of people have sent have sent me hardware to get some measurements from, and the way I do it is "if you send me hardware to measure, the first set off the machine that "I" approve of is yours for free. I have 2 sets of hardware for 21 sized riggers. That still leaves 21 size mono's. Would anyone care to step up with some 45 or 67 size parts?

I haven't made any parts for nitro boats in the past because since I got back into boating in 2002, I have been running gas boats, and as you know, hardware for gas boats is considerably bigger and heavier than hardware for nitro boats. I know a 67 mono might weigh 8 or 9 pounds. My gas mono weighs 23. I know it will cost a lot more to run a nitro boat for a day. I can run my gas boat ALL DAY for less than $6.00, and I have been known to run the same spark plug for a whole season.

It won't do me any good to apologize to the guys at Speedmaster because I can't unthrow a rock or unring a bell or unspeak a word. What I can do is apologize for making a complete ass out of myself here in front of everyone.