Clean Start Window

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Can not go without saying
Rey Garcia showed this OLD DOG new tricks
The start window made a honest driver out of me
I am always good for at lest 4 jump starts
Good job Rey --- no GREAT job

Henry
Henry at our we should get a few seconds heads start don’t you think? Like a senior citizen discount. I keep testing around here but these young guys don’t want anything to do with it. Maybe you have more influence and can do better out west. Sure miss Hobart and seeing you and the west coast racers!
Thanks John
 
Just one more LITTEL note to add
There is a huge race coming up in district 19 NAMBA country that is racing for a LOT OF MONEY
You think for one minute there wont be some serious bitching about calls none calls etc etc etc
Model boat racing do'es need to step up if racing for money takes hold ( heaven forbid )
 
Just one more LITTEL note to add
There is a huge race coming up in district 19 NAMBA country that is racing for a LOT OF MONEY
You think for one minute there wont be some serious bitching about calls none calls etc etc etc
Model boat racing do'es need to step up if racing for money takes hold ( heaven forbid )

NAMBA allows cash prizes? Sounds like a really bad idea.
 
NAMBA does not allow cash prizes. So this should be interesting to hear why they are breaking the rules.
 
It's not a namba sanctioned race, it's more of an invitational one. I see this clear window as a positive step forward. It doesn't cost hardly anything to put a stripe on a piece of plastic. If nobody in your club wants to make one then don't. it's not a rule and you can continue to do things as you want.
 
Rey as I said before I applaud you. Anybody hear of KISS(Keep it simple stupid) Rey figured out an inexpensive way to help the hobby. It doesn't take batteries or power at all. The video was just to verify to the racer. Seeing is believing. I was recently down there racing and I would have to say, this was a needed tool when some guys went down to D19 from D9. Now if you want to debate over if these are toys or not go ahead. But I will take my que from the late Jim Wilson. It is a sport. Why? Because we keep score. RIP Jim
 
How did you replay the starts? On the phone display or on the laptop? Did you need any software to make this work?
 
We use a floating clock and bright orange string at our Can-Am race, calls are tight and there's very little if any arguing. ;)
I think a bright orange string or rope over the start line and a strobe at the instant of the start would make it easier for both racers and CDs. Strobe activates by the countdown tape would be technically challenging for me, hopefully someone in our sport could handle it. But a string delineating the start would be a baby step forward, with or without the video.
 
I think a bright orange string or rope over the start line and a strobe at the instant of the start would make it easier for both racers and CDs. Strobe activates by the countdown tape would be technically challenging for me, hopefully someone in our sport could handle it. But a string delineating the start would be a baby step forward, with or without the video.

We use one of Randall Thomas' old flip digit clocks, has a 5 sec. audio beep countdown and a strobe flash at the start.

Those with the string and it doesn't get any better IMHO, we have zero arguments on start calls. ;)
 
How did you replay the starts? On the phone display or on the laptop? Did you need any software to make this work?

Ken,

There is NO software required for the Clean Start Window... Using a simple phone camera, you can capture the entire start or finish of a race at the line with clear, defined and audible recordings.

Should a driver wish to review the video after a race, you simply press the play button and it will display on the phone... You can however, link to a laptop and play the video on a larger laptop screen or a Tablet. There are some great phone cameras like the iphone, that record in slow motion, Ultra High Definition and frame by frame. These tools make the review process that much easier than just relying on a CD's recollection.

Here is how we worked the CSW...

During the mill time, we start the recording on the phone at the TEN second mark and we shut the recording off just after the call is made ( ie: good or jump start) What you end up with are clips approximately 13 to 15 seconds long. It doesnt take much phone storage and does not require any external storage. The screens on todays phones are large and visibility is plenty good for reviews.

This is something that is relatively easy to make and the cost is really mitigated by the results. Frankly, once you have participated in a heat where a call was close and you benefitted from it versus being called a jump, and you had the ability to validate that call by review, you will wonder how we have gone so long without something so simple as this.

In the future, we would like to see a RULE in our district (for testing) that requires the CSW at all races and recordings of all starts for review. Additionally, we would like to see a "REVIEW RULE" implemented to allow racers to "appeal" a jump or "appeal" a "NON jump" call. Of course, we would have to address a prehistoric rule of making calls within one lap, but I am sure we can address both issues fairly .

One of the reasons for such a system is to maintain a "cooler heads atmosphere" during the racing day. We all know some will lose their minds or simply become upset with a start call and if there was a process in place where one simple word could defuse any situation, then the word REVIEW is that word. Now, we know time is of the essence at our races, especially when they are large, so a timely review system could go along way in assisting a club without substantial delays. On the other hand, after a few reviews, you will find that there are fewer disputes as the competitors will begin to trust the calls using the CSW and would be LESS likely to ask for a REVIEW.

We all know mistakes happen, we are all people, and sometimes bad calls are made. Sometimes the wrong boat is called for a jump simply because it is of the same color, sometimes during the comotion of a start the CD loses track of all the boats and simply guesses who jumped. There are a number of circumstances that could interfere in a good call and its time to work towards making the start calls easier to make.

Additionally, lets hypothetically say that the boat in front of you was called "GOOD" and you believe that it jumped, you could ask for a "REVIEW" of the start and if that boat was over, then the penalty would be called ( after review) and positions reassigned accordingly. This would eliminate the "ROYALTY" calls that we have seen from time to time.


A Review rule would look something like this:

Startline Review Rule

1) At all district 19 races, the "Clean Start Window" must be used for all starts along with a camera recording device.
2) CD's shall be required to record each and every start of every heat during the race weekend.
3) All Competitors shall have the right to "REVIEW" a start call.
4) Such a Competitor shall put forth a $10 Review Fee upon the immediate conclusion of a heat. Such a fee will be returned if a "call" is overturned, and such a fee will be forfeited to the host club if the "call" stands.
3) During a heat start, should a Competitor be called a "jump" start or a Competitor believes a "NON CALL" was made, the pitman shall notify the CD by saying one word.. "REVIEW".
4) At the conclusion of the heat and the review fee paid, The CD and two independent drivers not involved in that heat will review the recording. Two out of three opinions will determine the ruling of the call in question.
5) If a "call" is overturned, the positions will be sorted out accordingly and the proper points reassigned.
6) If the CD fails to press the record button and there is NO recording of the start, the Driver involved will have the call overturned by DEFAULT.
7) Calls must be clearly visible and defined without obstruction and without guesswork.
8) Once a Driver or Pitman calls out "REVIEW", that driver is obligated to put up the $10 review fee regardless of the outcome.
 
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I like the idea of the window , but reviewing starts ? There simply is no time for this at most races. The call is the call , that's it , done . Even though the cost of reviewing the heat would make some think twice it opens up a huge can of worms . There are too many classes and heats to run to start doing this imho .
 
I like the idea of the window , but reviewing starts ? There simply is no time for this at most races. The call is the call , that's it , done . Even though the cost of reviewing the heat would make some think twice it opens up a huge can of worms . There are too many classes and heats to run to start doing this imho .


Tom, this is a great point, however, we demonstrated that it would take less than 25 seconds to make a review and determine the outcome, and with the use of the CSW, the starts are MUCH cleaner leading to FEWER disputes. Those that wished to review, had the option and took advantage of it, even if it was a clean start just to see how close they came to a jump...

What you will find however, is the complete opposite of what we have today. FEWER competitors will challenge the start calls once they experience the use of the CSW... "TRUST" is the key.

If the competitors dont "TRUST" the guy making the calls ( without the CSW ) then those arguments arise. On the other hand, after a few reviews, you will see that competitors will not make a challenge knowing that not only were the drivers held accountable by video but so is the CD.

Remember, keeping the CD in check is also important. Both sides of the equation need to be accountable and memorializing the starts via phone recordings will do just that.

I understand how "change" can be disruptive, however, good change is always an enhancement.
 
Maybe we should do what big boats do. You jump the clock and it is a DNF (no points) Everyone just drive as hard as you want. A review at the end of the heat and no placement for being over, everyone moves up over the violator (s). I guarantee the starting line would change and clean itself up. No extra confusing laps to count just 6 for everyone. Make the starting line only active between 5 seconds and zero.
Mic


P.S. I like the CSW
 
Tom, this is a great point, however, we demonstrated that it would take less than 25 seconds to make a review and determine the outcome, and with the use of the CSW, the starts are MUCH cleaner leading to FEWER disputes. Those that wished to review, had the option and took advantage of it, even if it was a clean start just to see how close they came to a jump...

What you will find however, is the complete opposite of what we have today. FEWER competitors will challenge the start calls once they experience the use of the CSW... "TRUST" is the key.

If the competitors dont "TRUST" the guy making the calls ( without the CSW ) then those arguments arise. On the other hand, after a few reviews, you will see that competitors will not make a challenge knowing that not only were the drivers held accountable by video but so is the CD.

Remember, keeping the CD in check is also important. Both sides of the equation need to be accountable and memorializing the starts via phone recordings will do just that.

I understand how "change" can be disruptive, however, good change is always an enhancement.
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Yes I see your point that after a while the problem may be self correcting due to the increased scrutiny of the starting line .
 
Maybe we should do what big boats do. You jump the clock and it is a DNF (no points) Everyone just drive as hard as you want. A review at the end of the heat and no placement for being over, everyone moves up over the violator (s). I guarantee the starting line would change and clean itself up. No extra confusing laps to count just 6 for everyone. Make the starting line only active between 5 seconds and zero.
Mic


P.S. I like the CSW
Mic, which class of boats gives a DNF for starting early? I know, with the unlimited hydroplanes, that it's a one minute penalty. That is a fairly recent(within the past few years actually) change from the previous lap penalty that was used for decades
 
Tom, this is a great point, however, we demonstrated that it would take less than 25 seconds to make a review and determine the outcome, and with the use of the CSW, the starts are MUCH cleaner leading to FEWER disputes. Those that wished to review, had the option and took advantage of it, even if it was a clean start just to see how close they came to a jump...

What you will find however, is the complete opposite of what we have today. FEWER competitors will challenge the start calls once they experience the use of the CSW... "TRUST" is the key.

If the competitors dont "TRUST" the guy making the calls ( without the CSW ) then those arguments arise. On the other hand, after a few reviews, you will see that competitors will not make a challenge knowing that not only were the drivers held accountable by video but so is the CD.

Remember, keeping the CD in check is also important. Both sides of the equation need to be accountable and memorializing the starts via phone recordings will do just that.

I understand how "change" can be disruptive, however, good change is always an enhancement.
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Yes I see your point that after a while the problem may be self correcting due to the increased scrutiny of the starting line .


indeed. Thanks for your input..!
 
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