Can we be beaten by electric 1/8 Fastelectrics?

Is this true? What is fast these days, nitro or electrics. With new technology like brushless motors and LIPO cells and the new A123 cells electrics are going fast these days.. But can we still bea them in oval racing with our .67 nitro engines?

MrUnlimited said:

Is this true? What is fast these days, nitro or electrics. With new technology like brushless motors and LIPO cells and the new A123 cells electrics are going fast these days.. But can we still bea them in oval racing with our .67 nitro engines?

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I think the FE Scalers are nipping at our heels. Its not going to be long before they get those boats going thru the corners as good as ours. In a drag race we loose or ive seen it from Pauly...................Mike

MrUnlimited said:

But can we still bea them in oval racing with our .67 nitro engines?

Click to expand...

Honestly, with the way the current FE rules are written, no... an nitro 1/8th would not be competitive with a full-tilt FE 1/8th scale... The power is available to push a 1/8th scale hull well into the 70's... or way beyond it's stability limits...

HOWEVER, the guys actually running this class in NAMBA and IMPBA FE have kind of a "Gentleman's Agreement" to try to keep things in check, so they are self-limiting themselves by choosing power systems that match up well with existing Nitro 1/8th scale speeds, and that don't completely break the bank... So, what "could" be done and what "is" done are not the same thing... Guys are choosing smaller motors than they "could" be using, etc... to keep speeds in check... I think that any parity that exists is because FE WANTs to have parity...

You might want to get in touch with guys like Ken Joye or Alan Nayman and discuss this with them... they are active FE 1/8th racers...

Darin Jordan said:

MrUnlimited said:

But can we still bea them in oval racing with our .67 nitro engines?

Click to expand...

Honestly, with the way the current FE rules are written, no... an nitro 1/8th would not be competitive with a full-tilt FE 1/8th scale... The power is available to push a 1/8th scale hull well into the 70's... or way beyond it's stability limits...

HOWEVER, the guys actually running this class in NAMBA and IMPBA FE have kind of a "Gentleman's Agreement" to try to keep things in check, so they are self-limiting themselves by choosing power systems that match up well with existing Nitro 1/8th scale speeds, and that don't completely break the bank... So, what "could" be done and what "is" done are not the same thing... Guys are choosing smaller motors than they "could" be using, etc... to keep speeds in check... I think that any parity that exists is because FE WANTs to have parity...

You might want to get in touch with guys like Ken Joye or Alan Nayman and discuss this with them... they are active FE 1/8th racers...

Click to expand...

Thanks Darin, very informative. One of the resons why I ask this is: first nitro is getting more expensive, second I also race 1/10 touring cars. There most of us are racing brushless and we often beat the nitro cars especially out of the corners. There is even somebody who converted his 1/8 serpent car into electric:

He is really beaten everybody of the track

I know when I sold MOST of my gas boats last season to convert to FE I got some weird responses from people. Right now I still think the cost of building a full tilt 70mph FE boat is a bit expensive compared to a gas or Nitro boat but I am betting the cost of Lipo's will drop just like the cost of ESC's and Brushless motors did. When brushless boats can run 5 minutes on one charge and the cost of Lipo's drops you will see more and more guys converting over. I was one of those guys that I talk to in chat at night that said I would NEVER buy a electric boat....I was wrong, I am a fully converted FE guy that has a gas boat that collects dust

Hi all,

I am still getting my feet wet again with 1/8's and chose to run nitro. I have been impressed with 1/8 scale electrics I've seen run, although I'm not sure of all the technical stuff which is talked about regarding them :huh: . They even seem to sound a lot like the real deal. I saw a video on Youtube,

. Hopefully this works. I don't know if you've seen this one, but this Bud is flyin' right up until it blows over.
DaveyK B)

Darin Jordan said:

MrUnlimited said:

But can we still bea them in oval racing with our .67 nitro engines?

Click to expand...

Honestly, with the way the current FE rules are written, no... an nitro 1/8th would not be competitive with a full-tilt FE 1/8th scale... The power is available to push a 1/8th scale hull well into the 70's... or way beyond it's stability limits...

HOWEVER, the guys actually running this class in NAMBA and IMPBA FE have kind of a "Gentleman's Agreement" to try to keep things in check, so they are self-limiting themselves by choosing power systems that match up well with existing Nitro 1/8th scale speeds, and that don't completely break the bank... So, what "could" be done and what "is" done are not the same thing... Guys are choosing smaller motors than they "could" be using, etc... to keep speeds in check... I think that any parity that exists is because FE WANTs to have parity...

You might want to get in touch with guys like Ken Joye or Alan Nayman and discuss this with them... they are active FE 1/8th racers...

Click to expand...

Key note- current F/E rule.

It wont be long till that changes if most have their way, then will they be on an even keel - so to speak- DARIN ?? The potential is there to be used, do you think the nitro guys would let it sit off to the side if it was available? Heck no, Nor will the F/E racers. Once again the key word- racers- we all wanna go as fast as we can yes ?? Not a bash- just a question.......

Andy

Drew2 said:

Key note- current F/E rule. It wont be long till that changes if most have their way, then will they be on an even keel - so to speak- DARIN ?? The potential is there to be used, do you think the nitro guys would let it sit off to the side if it was available? Heck no, Nor will the F/E racers. Once again the key word- racers- we all wanna go as fast as we can yes ?? Not a bash- just a question.......

Andy

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Andy,

I think you are right... Just like with the length limit arguement and with Lipos before that... most of us racers involved do not WANT things to get really out of hand... so we've been self-regulating to keep competitiveness in check until the appropriate rules are in place... For example, our club, and MOST of the clubs out here, have either been running (ours), our are going to be running under the proposed length restrictions... all VOLUNTARILY... We COULD have been running Sport 40 hulls at 60+ mph on 4S Lipos... but we know the implications of that.... so we've been patiently restricting ourselves... most of us anyhow...

Same with 1/8ths... All of the active FE guys in 1/8th KNOW they could go MUCH faster... but they choose to self-regulate at this point to keep from scaring people off while the rules sort themselves out... There are many who would like to see some kind of official motor limitation on these, but as has been discussed at nausium, that's a lot harder to do than it sounds...

There should be a good showing of 1/8ths in California in June at the 2008 FE Nats... Should be a good show!

Darin Jordan said:

Drew2 said:

Key note- current F/E rule. It wont be long till that changes if most have their way, then will they be on an even keel - so to speak- DARIN ?? The potential is there to be used, do you think the nitro guys would let it sit off to the side if it was available? Heck no, Nor will the F/E racers. Once again the key word- racers- we all wanna go as fast as we can yes ?? Not a bash- just a question.......

Andy

Click to expand...

Andy,

I think you are right... Just like with the length limit arguement and with Lipos before that... most of us racers involved do not WANT things to get really out of hand... so we've been self-regulating to keep competitiveness in check until the appropriate rules are in place... For example, our club, and MOST of the clubs out here, have either been running (ours), our are going to be running under the proposed length restrictions... all VOLUNTARILY... We COULD have been running Sport 40 hulls at 60+ mph on 4S Lipos... but we know the implications of that.... so we've been patiently restricting ourselves... most of us anyhow...

Same with 1/8ths... All of the active FE guys in 1/8th KNOW they could go MUCH faster... but they choose to self-regulate at this point to keep from scaring people off while the rules sort themselves out... There are many who would like to see some kind of official motor limitation on these, but as has been discussed at nausium, that's a lot harder to do than it sounds...

There should be a good showing of 1/8ths in California in June at the 2008 FE Nats... Should be a good show!

Click to expand...

I respect and applaud the things the F/E guys are doing with the 1/8ths (and a few other classes) The boats are stupid fast lately , Good luck with the "self limitations" I respect those that can and will abide by them, but the truth of the matter is- if its faster and you can buy it- they will....... I say let em eat with as much as you can toss at em, and don't worry about running with the nitro guys. I'd **** near pay to see faster 1/8th scale racing than we have now in D-3 with the nitro boats, somehow I cant see it. Why worry about running head to head with nitro at this point ???? Your shooting for the moon- why stop here :huh:

Andy

I'd **** near pay to see faster 1/8th scale racing than we have now in D-3 with the nitro boats

Andy, I kinda take this as a slap in the face!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And this coming from someone that can't even get a boat on the water??

Rick

flascaleboater said:

I'd **** near pay to see faster 1/8th scale racing than we have now in D-3 with the nitro boats
Andy, I kinda take this as a slap in the face!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And this coming from someone that can't even get a boat on the water??

Rick

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How much would you pay? Don't take it as a slap I am sure it was not meant that way.

The IMPBA FE rules (trial this year and last) are limiting the 1/8th motors. Plett 370/A1/s, Lehner 2280 or Neu 15 series.

I do believe that most scale racers like to keep things mostly scale. Nitro or Electric I hate to see blow overs or stuffs.

Too much damage for all the hard work....

By the way I was just at the Toledo Weak Signals show and there is a Dealer that sells Real Turbine set-ups for 1/6 and 1/8th scale. 100 plus mph

I can't believe he keeps them on the water and in a blow over there would be nothing left. By the way his turbine power package is $4000.

HT

MrUnlimited said:

Is this true? What is fast these days, nitro or electrics. With new technology like brushless motors and LIPO cells and the new A123 cells electrics are going fast these days.. But can we still bea them in oval racing with our .67 nitro engines?

Click to expand...

I have not seen any electric win a heat race in scale yet.

Not that the boat is not as fast but they seem to not able to control their speed like the nitro boats and lose power or spin from too much.

By the way I was just at the Toledo Weak Signals show and there is a Dealer that sells Real Turbine set-ups for 1/6 and 1/8th scale. 100 plus mph

I can't believe he keeps them on the water and in a blow over there would be nothing left. By the way his turbine power package is $4000.

HT

HA You belive any of that sales pitch Saw one of those too and it didnt go 100

D-1 IMPBA has some excellent running F.E. Scales and some first class people racing them.

If they did not regulate themselves they could easily beat a 67 powered Scale boat period .

We had a trial race last year with Nitro and F.E. mixed and the F.E. boats were regulated to match the speeds of the nitro boat to make it a little more interesting and fun for all.

A F.E boat won the weekend not because Pete was faster but because he had a better set up and he out drove the rest of us.

Tim K

Faster? Sounds cool, but from what I've seen in RCU and UNW the last 7 years is that some guys are barely holding on with the speeds we are going now. Some of that, of course, is because the boats don't handle very well. You could probaly put bigger nitro motors/props and go faster, but is that the point? To me it's about competition. Without some sort of regulation in any class as to engine c.i.d. or the electric motor and the number of batteries it comes down to cubic money instead of making the best of what the rules allow and driving skill. Most nitro boats running with a good tune are within a couple of miles an hour of each other. With a playing field that level it has come down to not how fast you can go, but rather how slow you can go to grab lane 1 and then accelerate like a rocket to keep it. At least around here you don't see that many boats being passed on the outside unless someone makes a mistake. This makes for some absolutly great racing though. Having a slightly slower boat on the inside than the overtaking boat really makes it come down to driving skill. I've had races that it has taken me 4 & 1/2 laps to get around somebody and conversly had to hold another boat off for several laps-now THAT is FUN!!

A boat that is 70-80 mph? We could really have some goods blow overs and wrecks then. I was happy to quit taking my rc stuff home in a bucket when I quit flying airplanes.

flascaleboater said:

I'd **** near pay to see faster 1/8th scale racing than we have now in D-3 with the nitro boats
Andy, I kinda take this as a slap in the face!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And this coming from someone that can't even get a boat on the water??

Rick

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Geeze- Go have some coffee and wake up Rick. You took my point TOTALLY out of context- My POINT WAS there are some very fast 1/8th scales in our area and they would be hard pressed to be beaten by an F/E boat (except yours of course) <_< They would be hard pressed to run much faster and finish...........

I'm gonna have to slap your other cheek next time I see ya for the smartazz boat comment by the way.

Andy

I think I love just about every kind of rc race boat there is.....nitro, gas, electric....1/8 scale, outriggers, sport hydros, cats, tunnels, outriggers..all the above, that being said, what good is all of the speed in the world, if you cant control it for 6 LAPS? Even unlimited hydroplanes have limits put on them.....Ive seen and have been in some very exciting races with 20 stock outboards, not because they were doing 90 mph and just being aimed to go around the bouys, but because they were being DRIVEN around the course at close to the same speeds because they were COMPETITIVE with each other...I think that speed is awesome, but ill bet if there were 6 or 7 RTRS that were closely matched racing deck to deck for 6 laps at 38 to 40 mph it would be a blast to watch or do. Domination is totally boring except for the guy who is dominating!

1/8th scale is by rule motor limited so to say the electric guys are just being nice and not going balls to the wall to beat them is a catch 22, don't you think. If you where to convert the HP of the .67 to watts and then come up with a sutible electric that meets that critera then it is back to being even or maybe in the nitro's favor because of the weight. Then the nitro guys would have to add more weight to make things even for them so it is a spec class all over again. What if there was an open hydro class where anything goes and then every one would race what they brung type race. Just my thoughts and racing against Roger's electric a few times, it was fun but RCU put in the rules once a boat is called a dead boat you can not start up again and race.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nzk3fH1ItzY

Im a nitro guy myself but I think they have us beat. :angry:

the guy in this vid did 120+mph. I met him on another forum if I remember right he did get the ticket for his truck parked wrong.

Hurricane said:

If you where to convert the HP of the .67 to watts and then come up with a sutible electric that meets that critera then it is back to being even or maybe in the nitro's favor because of the weight.

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I'd give Nitro the weight break... the electric has a major torque and power advantage and a much wider prop selection because of it... No pipe to stay "on", no needles to be "off", etc... just raw power right from the pull of the trigger...

I'd love to see someone come up with a method of matching the watts, however... Been talked about a LOT, but thus far, just a nice theory that doesn't seem to have a practical means of implementation...