Gripe!

Intlwaters

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Joined
Nov 18, 2005
Messages
1,674
I'm going to ***** for a minute so beware.
Way back in the 90s we had "bag phones" that could get a signal from 5 to 10 miles away. Today, every new phone you buy has a shorter and shorter signal reach. Some snot nose college puke straight out of college decides we don't need to reach distant signals. 50 percent of the population lives on the city where there are towers every half mile. Screw the rest of us.

Same goes for rc radios! Some idiot decided most surface radios are for cars so SCREW THE BOATERS! So now we have to buy after market antennas and put them on high dollar dual antenna receivers just to go around in a circle. I'm so over this NEW IMPROVED TECHNOLOGY! I'm going to dig out my old Square futaba radio from the 70s and weld that antenna on my thousand dollar piece of s#!^.
 
Certainly know what you mean about weaker cell phones. Less tranmit power is more battery to them I think and battery life is a spec people look at. The actual power the phone has to keep a signal is not even searchable for any phone models so you don't know until it is too late and you own it. I know my friend just upgraded(lol) his phone and now it won't work at his house without crazy noise like guitar strings strumming.

As for Futaba receivers 99% of users get along perfectly fine with the short antenna's the receivers come with. If they were needed for marine use they would sell a marine one with a long antenna already installed. The long antenna is a gimic very few hulls and setups actual need for anything.
A 16" long antenna doesn't belong in many radio boxes for any reason. Straight up BS.

If Futaba really intended them to be done that way even after the fact you would see them advertise the service or be selling the antenna in mainstream stores. It wouldn't be such a mystery where to get one and/or where to have it done. It would be listed in the owners manual with special warning for marine use. It would be posted in every advertisement for surface radio's if it was in any way a requirement or even a recommendation. Futaba covers everything in their literature and I haven't seen it spelled out in black and white in any literature that comes with surface radios.

As long as you put all that antenna they give you straight up in a antenna tube you are golden. The wire isn't meant to be run around the box first then up the tube.

Velcro directly under lid and all of it straight up the tube and you will have perfectly fine robust connection.

This is how the antennas should be. Almost every inch goes up the tube. Of course the new receivers you can't run two anymore but just showing how they should be.

15 years of setting up boats like this and it has never been a problem. With only one receiver of course. This was just a redundant system with two batteries. two switches and two receivers. Super safe because I could but surely only extra safety not required and only one of a few I run that way.

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$20,000 build. Look at the antenna tube length. You only need the tip out above the rest and your good.

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46cc two speed 4 wheel drive bad to the bone $6000 buggy. Short antenna.

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So,,, I just read several pages of the DSM thread where everyone says the diversity receivers need to be positioned with the label facing up for the internal antenna to be effective....
And here are pictures of receivers velcroed upside-down??? 😣

Man,,,, FM 1024 PCM radios were never this picky...Still not sold on all this DSM stuff,,,

I really think that DSM is more of a convenience thing to people that no longer wanted to deal with multiple channels any longer..
Its not necessarily a better radio...
 
Only boats I had an issue with were CARBON boats. All of my nitro boats have the ant. in the box. I have a new gas boat im going to use a 400mm ant. on only because of pipe location. Im not afraid of reception as im not doing straight away trials where distance could be an issue
 
Frank.... I don't think I have ever said that. Please let me know if thats the case.. Is it BEST.. yes.. recommended.. yes..

I too had issue when we first made the switch over to 2.4.. But with a few simple install notes its BEEN YEARS!

Is it a better system?.. Just feature rich makes it a better system to me but thats a mere nothing to most. Its nice to have all the adjustability, I love the telemetry!

The big one for me is Multiple MODEL MEMORY, (model copy is awesome too) This can save money by not having to buy more then one system, make sure its charged and drag it to the pond (or flying field too).

It is a matter of perspective.

Sorry your dissatisfied Wes. You know I want to help when I can. And you know I will do what I can to help you get more comfortable with the changes.

Grim
 
So,,, I just read several pages of the DSM thread where everyone says the diversity receivers need to be positioned with the label facing up for the internal antenna to be effective....
And here are pictures of receivers velcroed upside-down??? 😣

Man,,,, FM 1024 PCM radios were never this picky...Still not sold on all this DSM stuff,,,

I really think that DSM is more of a convenience thing to people that no longer wanted to deal with multiple channels any longer..
Its not necessarily a better radio...
Frank, I could be wrong, not sure???
Something else posted was "the internal antenna needs to be 90* from the external antenna"
I don't think the system knows if it's upside-down or not.
Think the main message is the 90* part.
Grim, yes or no?
 
In our surface installs its best to have the label facing up. that's the optimum position for the internal antenna. if you have the RX upside down in the boat YES.. the antenna is the in the proper orientation BUT.. then would need to preform though the PCB.

In the end..

Its BEST to have the RX label facing up and the external antenna straight up out of the boat as far as it can go. If one choses to use a 400mm antenna very good.. if not that's all fine and well.. I am still going to recommend the 400mm unit in all boating applications.

Hope this helps

Grim
 
So,,, I just read several pages of the DSM thread where everyone says the diversity receivers need to be positioned with the label facing up for the internal antenna to be effective....
And here are pictures of receivers velcroed upside-down??? 😣

Man,,,, FM 1024 PCM radios were never this picky...Still not sold on all this DSM stuff,,,

I really think that DSM is more of a convenience thing to people that no longer wanted to deal with multiple channels any longer..
Its not necessarily a better radio...

Grim,
You did. Lol. You got everyone scared to death they are doing everything wrong.

On and on about label facing up. I didn't read it though, It was straight from the horses mouth in the Diversity receiver video you made. Guessing you wrote it somewhere too if Frank read it.

Just more BS is all. Same as long antenna's being any kind of a requirement whatsoever.

The internal antenna is polarized the same way up or down. Having a circuit board over top of the internal antenna is mostly irrelevant unless you are in flying over the lake with your transmitter controlling your boat from above. Not sure the difference from shoreline is enough to matter. Possibly a iota but unlikely much at all if any different. I like mine under the lid. Where else you going to put it to face it up. On the bottom. That is worse down in the boat. Over a servo. I mean really where is it highest in the box and out of possible water intrusion and convenient to get to. I will always choose under the lid upside down so all the antenna is going up the tube and that is perfectly fine for almost every installation there has ever been.

I love the Futaba 2.4ghz and never have had a single issue with it using it as purchased well except the internal thin tin foil antennas corroding in the receivers. Straight up junk that doesn't even belong in a potentially damp environment our receivers sometimes get subjected to. The surface receivers would be worlds ahead if they just dumped that internal tin foil pos antenna and used two wires like their aircraft receivers utilize. Even if one was left in the box it would be WAY better design that would increase the range considerably.
Why do you think they don't build the aircraft receivers the same way ? To maximize the range is my guess out of necessity. Two wire antennas.

Please post printed material from Futaba that states a recommendation of this long antenna being installed for marine use and the label must be facing up. It is like a act of god to even find the long antennas so pretty sure they aren't expecting you to use them exclusively for marine duty or they would be available with it either already on the receivers. or separately or a place to send them to get it done and what it cost to do. I do not see any of that ANYWHERE !!!!

Futaba Team Marine is surely not authorized from corporate Futaba to make these recommendations to do so on their behalf.

They are advertised for marine use but none of this is in any literature from Futaba I don't believe so has me thinking it may just be more BS coming from mostly a single individual on a mission to get people to do what he does because he thinks it is required for some reason. Of coure no arguement the antenna need to be up a tube as high as te litgtle short one will reach and all of it up the tube. If that is not possible MAYBE you could benefit from a long one but to just say if your using it in a boat it must be replaced to be dependable is completely incorrect.

I have never used a long antenna yet and have never had a need to and I build a lot of top level high end race boats that have won at the top level of racing at the Winternationals and the Superboat shootout on numerous occassions.

Sure if you can't get your antenna up out of the boat then maybe you don't need a long antenna as much as taught how to install it so the antenna they come with is plenty. I actually despise those long pos with a vengeance. People tear up the short ones imagine another foot of wire in the box. OMG. NO!!!!!!

You give someone that much wire and they are running through the sides of the box and remote mounting the tube and all sorts of scary chit no body should be given enough wire to even do.

Just do not ever fold the coax over the top of tube and cap it. That is sure death to the fragile coax cable.
 
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Thanks for all your suggestions and tips Grim! The best ambassador Futaba has! Your YouTube videos and posts are invaluable to a lot of guys who may not know these newer systems as well. I still learn a few things every now and then

Personally haven’t found a need for a longer antenna or a label- up install but that doesn’t mean they aren’t helpful in certain scenarios. Whatever works best for you is the only aspect to keep in mind.
 
"Just do not ever fold the coax over the top of tube and cap it. That is sure death to the fragile coax cable."

You can not bend coax over the tube like that. It will weaken the cable but the real issue is the signal has a hard time traveling in the coax. The recomended bending radius of any coax is 5X the dia. Any more than that and you will be cutting down on the signal strength. The coax has a center conductor surrounded by a plastic insulator and then an outer shield. The signal bounces back and forth from shield to conductor. So it is like a plumbing pipe. The more you kink the pipe the less water makes it thru.
Mike
 
Real life testing trumps theory EVERY TIME. All I know is there were 6 boats going thru turn 4,5 and 6 all at the same time and james lost reception. Yes, it was a single antenna rx and yes, the antenna was folded over the top with that black rubber cap. I thought I had a 2 antenna rx installed. U bet your @$$ it's in there now. We o ly seem to be having g problems now that the racing is so close with roster tails hiding the boats.
 
Your manual states to doos and donts of you rx system. Take a peek at the wes.. the manual is your best resource. Grim
 
Also, that boat ran 4 heats with a 500ma battery. It was down to 6.3 or 5.9 with a draw. Its the biggest battery I can get in the box.
Wes you said" Real life testing trumps theory EVERY TIME. All I know is there were 6 boats going thru turn 4,5 and 6 all at the same time and james lost reception. Yes, it was a single antenna rx and yes, the antenna was folded over the top with that black rubber cap. I thought I had a 2 antenna rx installed. U bet your @$$ it's in there now. We o ly seem to be having g problems now that the racing is so close with roster tails hiding the boats." Dont ever fold the top inch over. Poke a tiny hole in the cap for it to come out of
 
Your manual states to doos and donts of you rx system. Take a peek at the wes.. the manual is your best resource. Grim
No! You are the best sorce of info! You actually race boats and actually do real world tests. I replaced 14 recievers and antennas but forgot that one boat. You give super good advice . I'm just frustrated that the old crystal radios never had any issues for me and I'm having problems catching up to this "improved" technology.
 
Only boats I had an issue with were CARBON boats. All of my nitro boats have the ant. in the box. I have a new gas boat im going to use a 400mm ant. on only because of pipe location. Im not afraid of reception as im not doing straight away trials where distance could be an issue
You are also very high up at your location. The signal can't "skip" off the water.....so I'm told. And "yes" I'm old as dirt!. Let's just say i raced Mikey when he had hair!
 
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