Production RTR Class

[gooycheese]

Hi All,

I noticed that there is still questions regarding the rules of the RTR class. I am writing this post in hopes of clearing them up. In 2006 there was a rough set of rule written up for the RTR class. Since that time the rules where tweaked a bit and the rules where in place for a 1yr trial period which was 2008. In December 2008 Roostertail on page 7-9 there is a copy of the rules that was voted on and approved as of 02/03/09 by the board of directors based on the votes they had gotten from there districts.

For those not very good at navigating the Roostertail below is the rules.

Page 7: Back in the December 2006 Roostertail, a discussion item appeared concerning an

update to our obsolete Production RTR Class. That update was submitted by Chuck

Gardiner in D12 and Kelly Miller in D6. Since that time they tweaked the rules a bit

which brings us to the rules shown on the next few pages. Very recently, the

IMPBA Board of Directors voted to place the rules in effect for a 1 year trial period.

Production RTR

Introduction

Many people have noticed the explosive growth of ready to run boats. The value these

boats provide to the beginning or budget boater contributes greatly to their success. For a

small amount of money, someone can buy a complete package (boat, engine, and radio)

that has known performance, and some guarantee of success.

What has also been noticed is that these boats often do not fit into any of the established

classes that are run at IMPBA clubs or inter-club races. This creates quite a dilemma. On

the one hand there are many potential new racers buying boats, but on the other, the

clubs cant always find a good way to participate.

Some clubs are resolving this impasse by holding ready to run classes and even entire

events devoted to ready to run boats. These grassroots efforts are great, because they

start to bring newcomers or casual boaters together to do what we all enjoy, run boats.

Other clubs who havent yet figured out what to do with RTR boats end up inadvertently

turning away potential members because they havent quite figured out how to support the

RTR boats yet.

However, while this is going on, there are concerns about compatibility and standardization.

Is it fair for someone who buys a ready to run boat and keeps it stock to have to run

against someone who bought a ready to run boat and then spent hundreds of dollars upgrading

the boat and engine? While we all want to go as fast as possible, not everyone

can, or wants, to spend hundreds of dollars upgrading an engine just so they can compete

on an equal footing.

The IMPBA already has Production ABS and Production RTR rules in the book (last two

sections of chapter H Nitro Specialized Classes). Unfortunately, as weve seen, the RTR

manufacturers didnt pay much attention to these rules, so there are few if any boats to

run in them. Meanwhile, RTR boats in other sizes and classes have been selling like hot

cakes.

With these concerns in mind, Kelly Miller and I have put together some ideas on how to

solve these problems. We drafted a set of rules for ready to run classes. The rules cover

two divisions, stock and modified. Here is a short overview of the proposed classes:

Page 8: Production RTR

Introduction - continued

Stock class

Boat must remain mostly as originally manufactured. The engine and exhaust system

must remain stock. Non-performance enhancing changes such as alternate decals, repainting,

etc are permitted. Minor adjustments such as sanding the bottom of sponsons,

adjusting the length of tuned pipes, as well as replacement of maintenance items such as

fuel lines, alternate propellers, dive shaft, flex shaft collets, receiver, batteries, and changing

the shape and size of turn fins and rudders would be permitted.

Modified class

Modified class permits replacement of the engine with an alternate stock engine, or modification

of the original engine, but the displacement cannot change from what was originally

shipped with the boat. Most any change to the boat would be permitted. People

who want to run an RTR boat with a larger than shipped engine should be encouraged to

enter it in an established class.

In order to get input from a wide audience, we had some discussions on a couple of the

online boards. During these discussions, references were made to specific engine displacements,

Sport 18 hydro for example. Since manufacturers do not appear interested in

following established classes, and its impossible to predict what they will do in the future,

these rules were specifically written without reference to displacement or fuel. Local preferences

will determine if .18 size Hydros are more popular than 1/8 scale gas Hydros,

etc. In many cases, different stock RTR boats from a variety of manufacturers can all

race in one class.

The key consideration is to try to put equally capable boats together so the drivers can

have fun!

The following page has are our ideas for an RTR class. These rules are being published

in this Roostertail for a 1 year trial period as approved by the IMPBA board of directors by

a most recent web conducted vote.

Page 9 : Production RTR Class Rules

Replace the entire Production RTR class rules with the following:

Technical Specifications

Classes - Boat hull must be of vacuum formed ABS plastic, wood, and/or fiberglass Production RTR. In order to

qualify as a production RTR boat, it needs to be, or have been, available to the public through nationally recognized

retail channels and at least 300 boats need to have been produced. All hulls must have positive buoyancy

characteristics when operated, and display colorful decals to enhance the spirit of this class. Classes may be divided

by manufacturer, model, propulsion type and sizes, average cost, or potential speed, if sufficient boats are

entered.

Stock Division:

Propulsion and Control Systems

1. Engine: The engine must remain STOCK. No internal or external modifications are allowed beyond replacement

of stripped or worn bolts with non OEM pieces. If the engine is replaced it must be of the

same model as was included by the manufacturer. If the original engine is no longer available, a replacement

engine of a similar size and price will then be allowed. If the engine was shipped with a head shim,

this can be removed. To promote competition, clubs can optionally permit boats that originally came with

a smaller displacement engine to be upgraded with a stock engine for the boats they are competing with.

2. Exhaust: Exhaust system must remain in the stock condition as the boat was received in the RTR box. If

equipped with a tuned pipe, length adjustments are allowed. Replacement of tuned pipe couplers with an

alternate material is also allowed. Addition of extra cooling outside the header is permitted. Also permitted

is the addition of extra muffling, to quiet the boat down, as long as the original exhaust remains in

place.

3. Starting method: The engine will be started using the method provided by the manufacturer. If equipped

with a flywheel that allows belt starting, a belt can be added and an electric starter used. In all cases, the

original starting equipment, such as a pull starter, must remain on the engine and be fully functional.

Unless specifically noted in these rules, modification of the original boat, including replacement or alteration of

parts, is not permitted. Exceptions are listed below:

1. Propellers: Replacement of the original propeller with aftermarket propellers is permitted.

2. Starting method: In cases where alternative starting methods were part of the stock boat, such as a

grooved flywheel on a pull start engine, the optional starting method is permitted.

3. Radio system: The entire radio system including transmitter, receiver, servos, battery, etc, can be replaced.

The original radio box can be replaced with one of a similar size and it must remain in the original

location.

4. Riding surfaces: The riding surfaces of the boat, the parts that contact the water, may be sanded to obtain

a true surface and square edges. Materials may not be added which change the original shape of the

running surfaces.

5. Turn fin, strut, and rudder: Modification or replacement of the original turn fin is allowed. Slots in the strut

can be lengthened to allow additional up and down movement. These parts can also be replaced with

add-on parts from the original manufacturer that are specifically designed for that model.

6. Engine mounts: To assist with noise abatement, solid engine mounts may be converted to rubber mount

via modification or replacement.

7. To foster variety, removing, adding, or replacing cosmetic parts, such as drivers, decals, paint, etc is permitted.

Modification of cowls to improve internal cooling is allowed. Rear wings, such as are included

with scale appearing Hydroplanes, must remain in place.

8. Alternate non-performance enhancing maintenance parts including fuel lines, flex shafts, and shaft collets,

can be used.

Modified division:

The modified division permits modification or replacement of all parts. The only limitation is that the engine must

have the same displacement as was originally shipped with the boat.

Racing Rules

Racing rules will conform to IMPBA contest and racing rules. Boats will run on full course or if desired, a short

course can be defined. This is a non US-1 Class.

I hope this clears any questions up?

Paul

 

[osracer]

Hi All,

I noticed that there is still questions regarding the rules of the RTR class. I am writing this post in hopes of clearing them up. In 2006 there was a rough set of rule written up for the RTR class. Since that time the rules where tweaked a bit and the rules where in place for a 1yr trial period which was 2008. In December 2008 Roostertail on page 7-9 there is a copy of the rules that was voted on and approved as of 02/03/09 by the board of directors based on the votes they had gotten from there districts.

For those not very good at navigating the Roostertail below is the rules.

Page 7: Back in the December 2006 Roostertail, a discussion item appeared concerning an

update to our obsolete Production RTR Class. That update was submitted by Chuck

Gardiner in D12 and Kelly Miller in D6. Since that time they tweaked the rules a bit

which brings us to the rules shown on the next few pages. Very recently, the

IMPBA Board of Directors voted to place the rules in effect for a 1 year trial period.

Production RTR

Introduction

Many people have noticed the explosive growth of ready to run boats. The value these

boats provide to the beginning or budget boater contributes greatly to their success. For a

“small” amount of money, someone can buy a complete package (boat, engine, and radio)

that has known performance, and some guarantee of success.

What has also been noticed is that these boats often do not fit into any of the established

classes that are run at IMPBA clubs or inter-club races. This creates quite a dilemma. On

the one hand there are many potential new racers buying boats, but on the other, the

clubs can’t always find a good way to participate.

Some clubs are resolving this impasse by holding ready to run classes and even entire

events devoted to ready to run boats. These grassroots efforts are great, because they

start to bring newcomers or casual boaters together to do what we all enjoy, run boats.

Other clubs who haven’t yet figured out what to do with RTR boats end up inadvertently

turning away potential members because they haven’t quite figured out how to support the

RTR boats yet.

However, while this is going on, there are concerns about compatibility and standardization.

Is it fair for someone who buys a ready to run boat and keeps it stock to have to run

against someone who bought a ready to run boat and then spent hundreds of dollars upgrading

the boat and engine? While we all want to go as fast as possible, not everyone

can, or wants, to spend hundreds of dollars upgrading an engine just so they can compete

on an equal footing.

The IMPBA already has Production ABS and Production RTR rules in the book (last two

sections of chapter “H” Nitro Specialized Classes). Unfortunately, as we’ve seen, the RTR

manufacturers didn’t pay much attention to these rules, so there are few if any boats to

run in them. Meanwhile, RTR boats in other sizes and classes have been selling like hot

cakes.

With these concerns in mind, Kelly Miller and I have put together some ideas on how to

solve these problems. We drafted a set of rules for ready to run classes. The rules cover

two divisions, stock and modified. Here is a short overview of the proposed classes:

Page 8: Production RTR

Introduction - continued

Stock class

Boat must remain mostly as originally manufactured. The engine and exhaust system

must remain stock. Non-performance enhancing changes such as alternate decals, repainting,

etc are permitted. Minor adjustments such as sanding the bottom of sponsons,

adjusting the length of tuned pipes, as well as replacement of maintenance items such as

fuel lines, alternate propellers, dive shaft, flex shaft collets, receiver, batteries, and changing

the shape and size of turn fins and rudders would be permitted.

Modified class

Modified class permits replacement of the engine with an alternate stock engine, or modification

of the original engine, but the displacement cannot change from what was originally

shipped with the boat. Most any change to the boat would be permitted. People

who want to run an RTR boat with a larger than shipped engine should be encouraged to

enter it in an established class.

In order to get input from a wide audience, we had some discussions on a couple of the

online boards. During these discussions, references were made to specific engine displacements,

Sport 18 hydro for example. Since manufacturers do not appear interested in

following established classes, and it’s impossible to predict what they will do in the future,

these rules were specifically written without reference to displacement or fuel. Local preferences

will determine if .18 size Hydro’s are more popular than 1/8 scale gas Hydro’s,

etc. In many cases, different stock RTR boats from a variety of manufacturers can all

race in one class.

The key consideration is to try to put equally capable boats together so the drivers can

have fun!

The following page has are our ideas for an RTR class. These rules are being published

in this Roostertail for a 1 year trial period as approved by the IMPBA board of directors by

a most recent web conducted vote.

Page 9 : Production RTR Class Rules

Replace the entire Production RTR class rules with the following:

Technical Specifications

Classes - Boat hull must be of vacuum formed ABS plastic, wood, and/or fiberglass Production RTR. In order to

qualify as a production RTR boat, it needs to be, or have been, available to the public through nationally recognized

retail channels and at least 300 boats need to have been produced. All hulls must have positive buoyancy

characteristics when operated, and display colorful decals to enhance the spirit of this class. Classes may be divided

by manufacturer, model, propulsion type and sizes, average cost, or potential speed, if sufficient boats are

entered.

Stock Division:

Propulsion and Control Systems

1. Engine: The engine must remain STOCK. No internal or external modifications are allowed beyond replacement

of stripped or worn bolts with non OEM pieces. If the engine is replaced it must be of the

same model as was included by the manufacturer. If the original engine is no longer available, a replacement

engine of a similar size and price will then be allowed. If the engine was shipped with a head shim,

this can be removed. To promote competition, clubs can optionally permit boats that originally came with

a smaller displacement engine to be upgraded with a stock engine for the boats they are competing with.

2. Exhaust: Exhaust system must remain in the stock condition as the boat was received in the RTR box. If

equipped with a tuned pipe, length adjustments are allowed. Replacement of tuned pipe couplers with an

alternate material is also allowed. Addition of extra cooling outside the header is permitted. Also permitted

is the addition of extra muffling, to quiet the boat down, as long as the original exhaust remains in

place.

3. Starting method: The engine will be started using the method provided by the manufacturer. If equipped

with a flywheel that allows belt starting, a belt can be added and an electric starter used. In all cases, the

original starting equipment, such as a pull starter, must remain on the engine and be fully functional.

Unless specifically noted in these rules, modification of the original boat, including replacement or alteration of

parts, is not permitted. Exceptions are listed below:

1. Propellers: Replacement of the original propeller with aftermarket propellers is permitted.

2. Starting method: In cases where alternative starting methods were part of the stock boat, such as a

grooved flywheel on a pull start engine, the optional starting method is permitted.

3. Radio system: The entire radio system including transmitter, receiver, servos, battery, etc, can be replaced.

The original radio box can be replaced with one of a similar size and it must remain in the original

location.

4. Riding surfaces: The riding surfaces of the boat, the parts that contact the water, may be sanded to obtain

a true surface and square edges. Materials may not be added which change the original shape of the

running surfaces.

5. Turn fin, strut, and rudder: Modification or replacement of the original turn fin is allowed. Slots in the strut

can be lengthened to allow additional up and down movement. These parts can also be replaced with

add-on parts from the original manufacturer that are specifically designed for that model.

6. Engine mounts: To assist with noise abatement, solid engine mounts may be converted to rubber mount

via modification or replacement.

7. To foster variety, removing, adding, or replacing cosmetic parts, such as drivers, decals, paint, etc is permitted.

Modification of cowls to improve internal cooling is allowed. Rear wings, such as are included

with scale appearing Hydroplanes, must remain in place.

8. Alternate non-performance enhancing maintenance parts including fuel lines, flex shafts, and shaft collets,

can be used.

Modified division:

The modified division permits modification or replacement of all parts. The only limitation is that the engine must

have the same displacement as was originally shipped with the boat.

Racing Rules

Racing rules will conform to IMPBA contest and racing rules. Boats will run on full course or if desired, a short

course can be defined. This is a non US-1 Class.

I hope this clears any questions up?

Paul

Thanks Paul. It looks like they covered everything but the fuel tank. A lot of us get rid of the original tank and replace it with a plane tank. To many problems at the fill cap. Thanks again for the post. Bill

 

[opio]

I will have to say YES those are the rules, but you should always check with your club for and "changes" they might let you do like the fuel tank issue. Does Namba have a set of rules for this? last I knew they didn't. but I have been wrong many times before lol!

for instance this part : The modified division permits modification or replacement of all parts. The only limitation is that the engine must

have the same displacement as was originally shipped with the boat.

that does not apply where I run, we can not have a motor worth more that 100$. meaning no cvr-m's, TZ's and so on, just saying this to show that different clubs do different things.

 

[william couch]

yes some clubs will bend the rules for club runnen. im just glad theirs rules now back then their wasnt and everybody was making their own up

 

[misshydro]

Thanks cheese that helps clearing somthings up...

 

[Tim leyde]

I plan to replace the stock .15 in the blackjack with a stock .18 from a duce. I'm in district 6 IMPBA. Would this be considered stock ( due to the fact it will be a stock motor) or mod. because it originally came with a .15?

 

[Jeremy Linney]

Is using a carbon tube over rudder linkage to help remove some deflection under load legal on a Deuce?

 

[SayMikey]

Jeremy its ok in D-14 This is the D-14 rules Changes you can make include:

 Any paint scheme

 Any Radio System

 The Exhaust may be changed to any legal exhaust per noise rules.

 The engine may be changed as long as it is from the same manufacturer as the boat hull and doesn’t exceed the .18 cc max. (ie. you may switch the engine in a ProBoat as long as you use a ProBoat manufactured engine. This boat comes with a ProBoat .15 and may be changed to a ProBoat .18)

 In the interest of time during all RTR races the Half Mill course will be in effect. Half Mill Means you throw your boat in the water, complete one lap, then you may cut the course between the number 6 buoy and the start clock. Boats coming down the back straight have right-of-way, you may move into any lane not taken by another boat as long as you have 3 boat lengths. This will tighten up the start and give us some GREAT RACING. By The way we have 12 boats in this class next weekend

 

[Tim leyde]

Thanks Mike. I'll see if the guys in my club will let me. If not, my nephew will have a extra motor.

 

[shannon o'shea]

Hi all this may or may not be a quick reply lol after reading this thread it gave me lots of inspiration to push forward with getting a rtr boat after being faced with the prospect of buying a huge gas boat or nitro boat or getting either built because thats all thats pretty much ran at my local club and the only electrics are 6s-10s monsters lol which are way out my skill range because any mention of RTR boats was mostly shot down ie ''too small.not competative,not popular,not strong enough, your better off gettin a gas or nitro boat.

So when faced with all that and the prospect of spending 500 plus on a used gas or nitro boat i pretty much gave up because it was too expensive and daunting even though theyre cool it just wasnt for me and when some club members arent really that interested it dont help while some have said build or get what you want and we will try and for you still sometimes doesnt suffice as you probably be put with monsters lol which is also a little bit daunting while running with similar powered boats makes you more comfortable and just leaves it up to driver skill while having a motley crew or similar against a driver who has 5 years experience as well as a boat with twice the power lol kinda really puts you off haha

And one day after reading threads like this i thought i have to do somethin about it and i posted a similar thread and thoughts on the ampba forum it did get support from some people and praise while it also got knocked back and told by someone were trying to cut back on classes and like i said to all newbs and casual boaters are back to being faced with spending alot of money or just turn away as most i know have done the latter as there in the same boat as me so to speak ie limited budget and skills.

But the biggest surprise i got was support from the ampba president and being suggested to be a newb ambassator and given praise for being passionate and detciated to this sportand i was quite honoured and he and a select few support me which is why im going to continue the fight for newbs and casual boaters and anyone else who doesnt want to go down the route of fuel boats or wants to change over by using a RTR boat.

As the only designation for electrics is the standard EA,EB,EC class which is anything goes as long as it has 4,6,10 cells which most who want to have an electric boat still have to spend a fair bit of money as most at the club have neu,castle shultz big dollar stuff as newbs think that is the only option spending 350 bucks on an esc and like 400 on a motor to be competative and alot dont want to or have the money to get a boat to that spec built.

So hopefully with more encouragement and a motley crew cat and plenty of discussion i can hope to start to pave the way for sport boaters and production boats in the future sorry about such a huge post but these thoughts are direct from a newb who which i represent lol and hopefully offer some further insight and help.

 

[Ron Olson]

Paul, there still could be issues elsewhere. Nowhere in the rules that I've seen actually specifies a cubic inch or hull limitation. A lot of people will simple assume that the RTR class is for the ProBoat and AquaCraft hydro's. No mono's or Cat's are mentioned as to whether or not they're legal. ProBoat and AquaCraft specialize in RTR boats, ProBoat up to .32 nitro engines. Thunder Tiger makes a .45 mono RTR. You can buy RTR Warehouse Hobbies gas monos.

Not to be nit-picky here but how does the IMPBA know that 300 RTR boats were made and sold as they don't release sales figures? In reality we know it but there could be someone who could challenge that.

When I had my Super-Vee 27 I felt that it was faster than the Miss Vegas but couldn't find out in competition. I feel like there are still a lot of loopholes that need to be filled.

Jeremy, as far as I know, slipping a carbon fiber tube over the linkage is allowed as it is not performance enhancing but an added safety feature.

BTW, the ABS class should be removed as it has never been used and there are very few if any boats left that meet the class requirements.