State of Affairs for RC Boat Racing

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Marty Davis

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2004
Messages
2,445
A Rant About the Current State of Affairs in our Hobby:

Like many clubs do after hosting a race and cleaning everything up, several of the members sit around drink a few beers and talk about the hobby.

We did that after our District 3 NAMBA Double Points Race this past weekend.

The topic was "what is happening to our hobby?" How do we get more interest and new members?

This race was hosted by 2 nearby clubs because of the lack of members between the two clubs. A sad state of affairs.

I have been in this hobby for 30+ years and have enjoyed almost all of them. I served two terms on the IMPBA Board of Directors.
Why is this important? I believe that the Board of Directors of IMPBA and NAMBA are primarily responsible for the decline
of our hobby.

Hear me out......

This past weekend race had 140 boats, a very small entry list for our area. We may see up to 300 boats for some races. BUT, how many classes were there in
this race? 21 classes.... Gas and Nitro.


Here is my reasoning:

For a 2 day race assuming an average of 8 heats per hour and a day of 9 hours there is a potential for 72 heats per day. For 2 days a total of
144 heats. In order to allow the contestants to leave by 4pm and head home after an awards ceremony we can assume that we can run off 135-140
total heats. With 21 classes at 6 boats per heat you can only get through less than 1 heat per class (6 boats), Sure doesn't make much sense to
try to run a 4 round race with 21 classes and only 1 heat per class. There are typically enough gas monos and gas cats to make up 5 heats for those classes.
21 hydro and 45 hydro usually could have at least 3 or 4 heats.

How in the world are we to put on a race with this burden of 21 separate classes???? In our District the host club MUST provide all of these classes for District sponsored contests.


About the Board of Directors Meetings:

I know that in past Board of Directors Meetings someone would come forward and say how cool it would be to add a 21 sized sport class, or a special Superboat Offshore
class. Wouldn't that be cool to add those classes for everyone to enjoy. NO, THAT wouldn't be a good idea and was NEVER a good idea.

This is NOT just the recent or current Board of Directors problem, it has been going on for a LONG TIME. Even as far back as when I was on the IMPBA
Board.


The Typical District Race:

If you have raced in races with 21 class or MORE, the wait between your runs is long and your probably won't get to race more that a dozen people.

This needs to change in one way or another.

1. Reduce the number of classes in the typical race.

or

2. Have specialty races that include whatever 10 or so classes and let MANY people per class race in each.

or

3. Split Gas and Nitro Races and also let a lot of people race in the 10 or so classes.

or

4. See our hobby continue to decline.


With so many options for people to enjoy their leisure time, we are competing against MANY other options for people. We need to
be competitive. We aren't at this point.


The Big Races:

The Charleston Race every year is sold out in a matter of an hour. Isn't this a good indication of people not getting to race in their
favorite class(s).

The WinterNats has become almost a total Gas Race (1 nitro class) and it has allowed many to race their favorite gas class.

Hobart, like the Charleston Race is sold out in a matter of hours. Again, people are not given the opportunity to race many people
in their favorite class(s). A really deserving US#1 Champion is ALWAYS the winner of the Internats. Excellence in all aspects.

The Nitro Winter Championships in Brandon Florida is a Nitro Only Race and it has only a few classes and it typically fills up with up to 30+ people
for several classes. Maybe this is the template for gaining members by allowing great competition for many in your favorite class(s).

Anyway, PLEASE Board of Directors don't keep adding "Cool Classes" which are continuing to hurt our great hobby.

A Side Note:

I have been told that the Huntsville Club will be offering the Internats in June of 2017 which is using the oldest format developed at the earliest Internats.

Everyone can choose to run for US#1 in their favorite class(s) by competing in the Trophy Trials (Straightaway and Timed Oval) and then in Heat Racing afterward.

We had a similar short version in Charleston a few years ago but this one is DIFFERENT. Everyone is allowed to compete in Trophy Trials rather than just the top finishing 6

finishers in heat racing. The Trophy Trials will be run first and the heat racing afterward. If a person wants to only compete in SAW he/she can come only for that day. If they want to compete in just heat racing, they can come only for those days but will not be eligible for US#1. You make the choice.

I can tell you from attending maybe 12-15 Internats that this will be the most fun you will ever do in this hobby. I can't wait for June.

Watch for the Huntsville Club to post the entry and plan to attend. Of all the clubs in the country, the Huntsville Club will be one of the very best hosts you can find.

Sorry for being so long winded, but now I feel better getting this all of my chest....
default_smile.png
 
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The reason is the cost not everyone has 800 plus dollars(entry level) for a toy boat. Also the ones that are dedicated run more then one class which is why your driver count is low but boat count is up. As to the classes it should be open to what the race racers want to race. I know in District 3 if not for gas classes clubs would fold very quickly. Nitro in are area is down and is why some of the gas guys are running nitro to help grow. If the heats are a issue raise the minimum number of boats to make a class like the winter Nats due. We ran plenty of heat at the past race with for example tunnels like only 3 boats if there isn't 6 doesn't make the class in my opinion. But as to your example superboat is one of the hottest classes running the past three years since we made it. I believe also if there is no willing for clubs to evolve with the hobby is why thing are the way they are now. Just my opinion but the race was fun.. but just a quick brake down for me

Entry fee. 75

Hotel. 215

Nitro. 120

Diesel. 100

Total. 510 for the weekend not including food. This is why I believe attendance is down the money is the majority of the problem lol
 
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Marty,

While I can agree on pretty much everything in your "rant" which, by the way is more of an observation than a true rant. I see other things that are also affecting our hobby.

Raul, I can only agree that COST is a huge factor for many people. Wife and I recently spent a weekend in Colorado and, between food, airfare, lodging and a rental vehicle, it was almost $2000. THAT WAS ONLY FOR A TWO NIGHT STAY!!!!!!!!!

So, that being said,let me throw some other issues and see where it goes:

1) Politics I know, with an awful presidential election coming up in a week, this subject isn't one that many want to broach. But it is a much bigger issue than most want to admit. In the past few decades that I've been around racing, I have seen that, for the most part, a "select group" of people are the ones running the show. I personally ran into this when rules changed to prevent me from building a boat in a way that members of that "select group" didn't approve of. Furthermore, the rules were "bent" to allow one of the "select group" to run a boat that was set up OUTSIDE OF THE RULES!!!!!! I never finished the boat I was working on after that, costing the group(which ultimately folded) another racer and boat. I'm sure variations of this happen in all clubs and, while the long term members usually ignore it, a newcomer will see it, watch the others and say "Screw This!!!!!"

2) Other things going on Again, something I had to deal with. Last April, for example, I missed two races due to being in Hawaii on a cruise. Missed the Northwest Scale Championships a few weeks ago, due to being in Colorado. I'm sure everyone had to miss races due to things like these

3) Work schedules/Vacation time Not everyone can just pack up and head to a race. This year, I had 10 days of vacation, burned them up on my Hawaii cruise. That stopped me from going to the NAMBA NATs and a few other races due to lack of vacation time. Those, like me, that still work, have wives and/or kids with other things that use up the vacation time aren't likely to try to head to every big event
 
Marty's first comment is the key in my mind. How do we get new members? Raul's $800 boat is realistic but that's a starter class which seem to be the first to die here. We have boats that run from $1200 to over 3 grand in large numbers. Add that 2 day $600 expense, plus Friday off work to travel and see how many new people sign up. Cost and time commitment.

I agree with a 5 boat minimum. It might kill the outboard classes I prefer but that's up to the numbers.This hobby/sport was built on friendly 1 day club races welcoming new racers and has mutated to ????. Where is the entry level with good competition and NOT a full RTR. Our tunnels were that at one time. New members ,new racers, new help to run a race. Hard to recruit people when they see trailers with thousands of dollars in boats and wonder how their one boat fits in. Most of the long time racers are more than willing to help and mentor new people but the threshold is getting set pretty high.

I have built and raced gas, nitro and FE, Splitting gas and nitro for some events makes sense to me. Adding FE to our district seems frowned upon with the possibility of more classes. Most fuel racers that don't understand FE and that it can be done safely and less expensive. Go to a flying field and see how many nitro planes are left. Fuel cars VS batteries, same outcome. Close your mind to FE and possibly your largest potential source of new blood also. It didn't happen overnight at flying fields but it did happen.

Mic
 
Marty I do agree a bit on the things you say. One of the things that make a good race is a good host club. We work very hard this past weekend as did you to put on a very good, I mean great race. And we did just that. We to ran 22 classes and some of the classes I like did not make. But we did run 5 rounds of a 110 heats and was finished by 2:00 Sunday afternoon. Of course this is the first fall race we have put on in a few years and we fill sure that it will build to a bigger race.

I to have watched the board create these classes that are taking up space. I heard of one board member saying that if we offer the class they will build them. There were not any boats of that class and are still not enough in the country to even built one heat.

Also one of the other problem is the ARTR (almost ready to run). No one builds anymore they just buy. A lot of these types of boater will not stay into the hobby. But with the JAE a lot of boater are starting to build there first boats. And this is good.

Here in Huntsville we will be putting on the 2017 IMPBA Internats starting June 10 to June 17. We plan on putting on one the best Internats that has come around in a long time.
 
Marty I do agree a bit on the things you say. One of the things that make a good race is a good host club. We work very hard this past weekend as did you to put on a very good, I mean great race. And we did just that. We to ran 22 classes and some of the classes I like did not make. But we did run 5 rounds of a 110 heats and was finished by 2:00 Sunday afternoon. Of course this is the first fall race we have put on in a few years and we fill sure that it will build to a bigger race.

I to have watched the board create these classes that are taking up space. I heard of one board member saying that if we offer the class they will build them. There were not any boats of that class and are still not enough in the country to even built one heat.

Also one of the other problem is the ARTR (almost ready to run). No one builds anymore they just buy. A lot of these types of boater will not stay into the hobby. But with the JAE a lot of boater are starting to build there first boats. And this is good.

Here in Huntsville we will be putting on the 2017 IMPBA Internats starting June 10 to June 17. We plan on putting on one the best Internats that has come around in a long time.
2nd as our world changes.
 
Marty I do agree a bit on the things you say. One of the things that make a good race is a good host club. We work very hard this past weekend as did you to put on a very good, I mean great race. And we did just that. We to ran 22 classes and some of the classes I like did not make. But we did run 5 rounds of a 110 heats and was finished by 2:00 Sunday afternoon. Of course this is the first fall race we have put on in a few years and we fill sure that it will build to a bigger race.

I to have watched the board create these classes that are taking up space. I heard of one board member saying that if we offer the class they will build them. There were not any boats of that class and are still not enough in the country to even built one heat.

Also one of the other problem is the ARTR (almost ready to run). No one builds anymore they just buy. A lot of these types of boater will not stay into the hobby. But with the JAE a lot of boater are starting to build there first boats. And this is good.

Here in Huntsville we will be putting on the 2017 IMPBA Internats starting June 10 to June 17. We plan on putting on one the best Internats that has come around in a long time.

Simple Reply...... CAN'T WAIT !!!!!!!
 
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Marty wish we could make it down in January this year that was one of the best NITRO races we have been to thank you for hosting a race like that we will try to come down in 2018!

OUR HOBBY HAS WAY TO MANY CLASSES BEING OFFERED!!!!!!!!!!! There is no possible way to have good competition at a 2 day race with 18-22 classes.

HOPE TO SEE ALL MY NITRO FRIENDS IN HUNTSVILLE NEXT YEAR FOR THE 2017 INTERNATS!!

Lets make NITRO boating competitive and fun again!!
 
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The reason is the cost not everyone has 800 plus dollars(entry level) for a toy boat. Also the ones that are dedicated run more then one class which is why your driver count is low but boat count is up. As to the classes it should be open to what the race racers want to race. I know in District 3 if not for gas classes clubs would fold very quickly. Nitro in are area is down and is why some of the gas guys are running nitro to help grow. If the heats are a issue raise the minimum number of boats to make a class like the winter Nats due. We ran plenty of heat at the past race with for example tunnels like only 3 boats if there isn't 6 doesn't make the class in my opinion. But as to your example superboat is one of the hottest classes running the past three years since we made it. I believe also if there is no willing for clubs to evolve with the hobby is why thing are the way they are now. Just my opinion but the race was fun.. but just a quick brake down for me

Entry fee. 75

Hotel. 215

Nitro. 120

Diesel. 100

Total. 510 for the weekend not including food. This is why I believe attendance is down the money is the majority of the problem lol
I also subscribe to this and in addition leisure time has many more outlets now than it did before . There are only so many weeks in a month and with other interests and obligations you can only stretch yourself / wallet so far .
 
Lot's of comments on too many classes and the same has been brought up in my district. What is the solution? Do we risk alienating a group of boaters which would potentially drive them away from the hobby? Because in my district, the FE and Nitro Boaters are the ones that would be on the chopping block. Hold specialized events for either nitro of gas? Only half the folks would show up. Hardly worth the effort it takes to host a race. Plus a number of folks in our district run run both types. Combine classes? Some folks are against that. Tough decisions...
 
WAY WAY to many classes.. cars can do it because it don't take as long to run a heat.. from start to finish. just faster.

access.. i have been driving 2 - 3 hrs one way to test for 20 yrs.. it sucks.. i have no local place to test.. people don't want you around for the most part.. again.. cars can run anywhere.

hobby shops.. they sell cars... planes.. quads... ect.. boats? not really.. why?? again, where do you go and run.. the river? lol.

cost.. ehh ok.. yes and know.. cost is cost no matter what hobby you are in.. either video games.. cars ( real cars ) or r/c stuff.. to me that is relative.. you spend what it is going to cost.. you either do it or not.. pretty simple.

lets face it. this is and always will be the smallest rc hobby there is.. but the KEY issue above all is young people.. you look at this hobby over the yrs.. i count on one hand the amount of NEW PEOPLE i ever see at races.. same people.. same races ect. not that it is bad but it is hard for a sport to grow when new people are far and few between
 
Marty

I do agree with many of the things you said and I really don't have a good answer either but I think that cost for a weekend race gets very expensive which probably has a lot to do with it. I do have to make a point about the nitro classes. There were 63 nitro boats in 12 classes .entered in the Brandon race. I do not know how many registered actually showed up. The Orlando Winternats has 25 nitro boats entered in 7 classes. Granted that two of those classes may be suspect to making the minimum number of boats but it is still early in the registration process. Our district director has make a concentrated effort to get more interest in racing in all the gas and nitro classes. Thanks for reading.

Bill Hoch

Stuart, Florida
 
WAY WAY to many classes.. cars can do it because it don't take as long to run a heat.. from start to finish. just faster.

access.. i have been driving 2 - 3 hrs one way to test for 20 yrs.. it sucks.. i have no local place to test.. people don't want you around for the most part.. again.. cars can run anywhere.

hobby shops.. they sell cars... planes.. quads... ect.. boats? not really.. why?? again, where do you go and run.. the river? lol.

cost.. ehh ok.. yes and know.. cost is cost no matter what hobby you are in.. either video games.. cars ( real cars ) or r/c stuff.. to me that is relative.. you spend what it is going to cost.. you either do it or not.. pretty simple.

lets face it. this is and always will be the smallest rc hobby there is.. but the KEY issue above all is young people.. you look at this hobby over the yrs.. i count on one hand the amount of NEW PEOPLE i ever see at races.. same people.. same races ect. not that it is bad but it is hard for a sport to grow when new people are far and few between
Social Media can help our sport grow.. With all the videos and pictures we are putting out there these days it will draw attention from new people who have never had a boat and also re kindle the fire in old racers who have got out of the hobby or put there boats in storage. All of us are gear heads here and we all have friends who are like us, show them your boats let them drive one help make our hobby better!!!
 
A lot of the folks today have games on the computer and TV where they just hit reset when things do not go well. Much cheaper than actualy having a real life experience. There are lots of issues that make it hard to promote the hobby, but I don't think the organizations are fully to blame. It is just the nature of what society has become. I have had the same conversations Marty had while at the races but don't have any solutions.
 
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The cost is what is holding it back for many. Supply and demand is what controls this. Less eng sold the more thy cost.

There are basically two option right now for engs. Nova Rossi and CMB. At average 500$ a pop it is not a user friendly hobby.

That and the hype over you have to have the newest and coolest stuff dose not help.

So how do you break the cycle of cost and demand????????????????????

Don't know but if some thing dose not give it will die off....................................Then there will be nothing for any one to make a buck on.
 
as with previous discussions about this, "too many classes" isn't the problem, it's a symptom. The root of the problem is "not enough people." The two clubs I'm in are significantly smaller than they were even 10 years ago. People leave because of any number of reasons; some lose interest, some get pissed at internal politics and storm off, some pass away. And there aren't very many people interested in replacing them.
 
Years ago in District 3 we had the RTR class which brought new people in because it was cheap to do with the engines now costing 400 and up it is not a cheap sport to have. Yes alot has to do with traveling and money having to pay for a weekend i figured it out to be over 1000 dollars for me for a weekend that is alot to alot of people. The main thing that is killing this sport is all the politics within the clubs new people see this and say i dont want any part of it and go else where, these are big boy toys lets play together
 
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The cost is what is holding it back for many. Supply and demand is what controls this. Less eng sold the more thy cost.

There are basically two option right now for engs. Nova Rossi and CMB. At average 500$ a pop it is not a user friendly hobby.

That and the hype over you have to have the newest and coolest stuff dose not help.

So how do you break the cycle of cost and demand????????????????????

Don't know but if some thing dose not give it will die off....................................Then there will be nothing for any one to make a buck on.
. David, my dad paid over $400 for a Rossi 65 in 1978. Before that, many races had nothing but ops 60's and k@b's at the races and only having a couple of engines to choose from did not matter at all. In fact, there were more people boating back then with far less classes. Just some facts about the past to think about.
 
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